bwahahahahah I posted again and predicted EXACTLY what you would say.Bootz wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:06 pmYou're the only one considering a division title a failure, kiddo. This team didn't have a high prognosis for this season and exceeded expectationsacmillis wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:03 pm
Is that a bad thing?
Also, I could say the exact same thing about Baker, "If you go into the year with Baker Mayfield as part of your plans, it's already doomed to fail."
Go ahead and miss me with the 8-9 wins and a (possible) division title is not failure BS. This team and Baker Mayfield are both mediocre. I don't want mediocre. And because of me not wanting mediocre, I want to move on from Baker and draft a rookie. Yes, roll the dice. The rookie might be worse than me at football, we don't know. The rookie might be better than Tom Brady at football, again, we don't know.
We know what Baker is, and to me, he is not good enough for my liking.
Welcome Baker Mayfield
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Until someone better comes along, it's Baker or bust.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
These decisions aren't made in a vacuum.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:22 pm Trask and a rookie? 1st round/2nd round? This is the way to winning?
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Just imagine Penix Jr., Nix, or JJ McCarthy throwing to Evans.Cheb wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:37 pmThese decisions aren't made in a vacuum.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:22 pm Trask and a rookie? 1st round/2nd round? This is the way to winning?
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
Someone needs to make a pic of McCarthy in a Buccaneers uniform.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
You are dense. Really, fucking dense. Like Osmium levels of dense.Bootz wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:06 pmYou're the only one considering a division title a failure, kiddo. This team didn't have a high prognosis for this season and exceeded expectationsacmillis wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:03 pm
Is that a bad thing?
Also, I could say the exact same thing about Baker, "If you go into the year with Baker Mayfield as part of your plans, it's already doomed to fail."
Go ahead and miss me with the 8-9 wins and a (possible) division title is not failure BS. This team and Baker Mayfield are both mediocre. I don't want mediocre. And because of me not wanting mediocre, I want to move on from Baker and draft a rookie. Yes, roll the dice. The rookie might be worse than me at football, we don't know. The rookie might be better than Tom Brady at football, again, we don't know.
We know what Baker is, and to me, he is not good enough for my liking.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
You can always game the numbers to make it work with restructures and extensions.Cheb wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:37 pmThese decisions aren't made in a vacuum.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:22 pm Trask and a rookie? 1st round/2nd round? This is the way to winning?
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
We’re a win away from another division title. I don’t see our division improving drastically next season. Do you?
I would prefer to capitalize on that while we can. Why reset our roster/team with Trask/rookie when we already know we can win with what we have and an $80M anvil?
Use the resources we have to put pieces around Baker for a couple years. He’s still young. He’s talented. He’s a leader.
These are things we know. I don’t want to dump him for unknowns.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
My guess is, no matter the decision on Mayfield, the likes of Godwin, Davis, Vea will have restructures and Wirfs will extend with a contract having his cap number kept low.Cheb wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:37 pmThese decisions aren't made in a vacuum.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:22 pm Trask and a rookie? 1st round/2nd round? This is the way to winning?
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
And I do not think we would have a better W/L record with Trask/Rookie next year.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Just go play lights out on Sunday, Bake. Leave no doubt.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Every other team passed on him in the first round. He started his first season backing up Flacco. In fact, like Purdy he never would have started if Flacco wasn't injured. They installed during the bye an entirely new offense just for Lamar which used his running first and passing second. But sure, act like I'm crazy. In all his starts that season, he barely reached 200 passing in one game at 204. And you say he wasn't a project at all? Revisionist history huh
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
At 32. All pro ready QBs are picked thereGreatTimes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:42 pmLamar wasn't a "project" to John Harbaugh. He was thrilled when Lamar was available when the Ravens drafted.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Then explain why he would have been QB2 all season if not for the injury and the fact he was told not to pass?Bootz wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 8:32 amLamar wasn't a project at all. Teams needing QBs simply dropped the ball.GreatTimes wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 9:42 pm
Lamar wasn't a "project" to John Harbaugh. He was thrilled when Lamar was available when the Ravens drafted.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
I meant he was meant to sit the first season as no team that needed a QB to start day 1 would have taken himGrahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 8:46 am Define project. This is the first year they’ve truly cut him loose as a passer. His inability to win from the pocket has been the reason the Ravens were eliminated from prior postseasons.
By @Snake ’s logic they should have moved on from him long ago because he has held his team back in the playoffs.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Only Lamar can beat the Ravens in the playoff. I want to see him take the next stepSnake wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 9:17 amAbsolutely agree that he’s been a postseason disappointment in the time that he’s played in the postseason. This year is a huge test for him. They are the AFC favorites, if not the favorites to win it all.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 9:10 am
He's a much better passer now than he was then. He hit deep balls for TDs at an unsustainable rate in that MVP year and regressed mightily the next three seasons. He's 1-3 in post-season play.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Here is another equation. The 5 year rule. If a QB/HC combo haven't won a Super Bowl in the first 5 seasons they never will. We have seen multiple occassions now that a QB goes to a new team and wins one. What's to say that can't happen here. By that logic, since Lamar never one a Super Bowl with Harbaugh, they should have jettisoned him for a rookie since it isn't going to happen now or fire Harbaugh and get a new coach since it's clearly the coach?CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 11:49 amYou're losing yourself, I've NEVER cut out Mayfield's best passing season, it was 2020 and I've mentioned it multiple times. I'll give you the perfect equivalent. Baker Mayfield = Joe Flacco. If you have an elite defense, elite running game, and a rookie QB contract, you can win games... even a Super Bowl. Once you stop paying the mediocre QB rookie money and giving starter money (that he doesn't deserve), you no longer can afford an elite defense and elite running game. Over the next 6 seasons, you have a sub .500 record and go 0-2 in the playoffs.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 4:25 pm
You're cutting out arguably Mayfield's best year as a passer in your comparison.
You're losing me. You don't like Mayfield, ok. That's fine. I'm not arguing that he's some elite player. He's good enough. Yes, you surround a good enough player with other elite players and good/great coaching chances are they will do well. What are we talking about here? Mayfield is a QB you have to commit nothing but mid-tier QB money to. If you move on you have to commit draft capital, and late draft capital at that, to the position and then start that player immediately or start Trask.
Why do some of you want to lose games so badly?
So, while you ask me why I want to lose so badly. My response is, I don't want to lose... I want to win. My question to you is, why do some of you want to be mediocre so badly? Why don't you want to win?
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Is he? Is it the new OC, the poor HC, the lack of production from our running game, the lack of a true #3 receiver, the fact Otten gets the dropsies on easy passes, the horrible iOL we have, or a combination of all of that? Yes he misses deep passes. How many time did Brady miss Evans and we collectively groaned in 2020 before everything clicked? 1-3 times per game? This is his first season with a new OC, and a HC who is either hindering the offense or won't say anything to the OC to try something else when the game plan isn't working. IF we have a season two with them all together and seeing that Palmer is finally coming around and if we fix the interior, get a downhill runner, and hopefully a veteran TE that can block and pass we may see a completely different player.CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 11:51 amGot it. So as long as Mayfield is a nice guy (which I will definitely say, he is... and I find him very likeable and funny), you're ok with keeping him despite the fact that he's holding the team back?kaimaru wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 4:27 pm
When I found out that Freeman was in the substance abuse program, I was done with him. I for one wanted to not even take the 5th year option on Winston after he groped that Uber driver. He would clearly never grow up and be a real franchise QB. I know a lot of people who felt the same
There is a reason there is a comment that a change of scenery can help players. I thought Stafford is exactly who you think Baker is. Exactly. I laughed when he went to the Rams. I pointed to his record. I pointed to the fact he had Megatron and Nate Burleson and did nothing. I got egg on my face for that. So, I am willing to see another year with him if they keep this coaching staff
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Because the team had Flacco and weren't forced into a position of playing Lamar early on. He was told not to pass yet did so 170 times that season. Naughty naughty.
Most hated man in America.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
You think the Ravens would have never played Lamar Jackson if Flacco didn't get hurt? Yea, just like the Chiefs would've never played Patrick Mahomes because they had Alex Smithkaimaru wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 5:19 pmEvery other team passed on him in the first round. He started his first season backing up Flacco. In fact, like Purdy he never would have started if Flacco wasn't injured. They installed during the bye an entirely new offense just for Lamar which used his running first and passing second. But sure, act like I'm crazy. In all his starts that season, he barely reached 200 passing in one game at 204. And you say he wasn't a project at all? Revisionist history huh
Most hated man in America.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
He was 103-82 6-5 in the playoffs outside that Super Bowl run and you would turn down that 11 year stretch?CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:04 pmIn the playoffs? That ONE year? Yeah... how about every other game that year or other years there? He was an average QB who didn't f' it up. I mean, good for him. Nothing wrong with that. We all know that average QB's can have great games... even below average QB's. Look at Nick Foles in the 2017 Super Bowl... even the NFCCG that year. Heck, in one other season he threw what, 7 TD passes against Oakland. That year, he threw 27 TD's and only 2 INT's. Let's not pretend that someone is better than what they are because of an isolated incident.
Flacco's best passer rating in any year was under 94. Nick Foles in one season had a 119. LOL
Joe Flacco 2012 playoffs... completed 58%, passes for 1140 yards and 11 TD's (4 games), had a 117.2 passer rating.
Nick Foles 2017 playoffs... completed 72%, passes for 971 yards and 6 TD's, 1 Int (3 games), had a 115.7 passer rating,
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
So you are saying Mahommes will never win another Super Bowl flat out?CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:11 pmYou CAN win with those guys... ON A ROOKIE CONTRACT! You CAN'T win with those guys on a big money contract. I mean, some people just want to take an argument someone is making... alter it (because they have no answer for it), and then argue against the altered argument that no one was making. LOLDoctor wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:07 pm These hero worshippers have been selling us this same nonsense for years. You need a super star!
You can win with a Flacco. An Eli, a Mayfield, Jimmy G, Cam, Vick or Kaep. In the right fit, you absolutely can.
Just like Lamar, Mahomes or Rodgers would lose miserably and be nobodies in the wrong situation. That's football.
Honestly, I think Rodgers is a choke artist in the playoffs, but that may just be me.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Or Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Jalen Hurts, Joe Burrow, or Justin Herbert.kaimaru wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 7:06 pmSo you are saying Mahommes will never win another Super Bowl flat out?CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:11 pm
You CAN win with those guys... ON A ROOKIE CONTRACT! You CAN'T win with those guys on a big money contract. I mean, some people just want to take an argument someone is making... alter it (because they have no answer for it), and then argue against the altered argument that no one was making. LOL
Honestly, I think Rodgers is a choke artist in the playoffs, but that may just be me.
Most hated man in America.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Baker is not getting $33m. Secondly we can and should save $5 for Shaq, $20 for CD3, $10 Gage (post-June) since none of them are worth their contractsCheb wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:37 pmThese decisions aren't made in a vacuum.Grahamburn wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:22 pm Trask and a rookie? 1st round/2nd round? This is the way to winning?
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
With Penix's injury concerns? With that and he tends to sail passes would make me not want him.Phantom wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:41 pmJust imagine Penix Jr., Nix, or JJ McCarthy throwing to Evans.Cheb wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 4:37 pm
These decisions aren't made in a vacuum.
We don't have a lot of room to make moves to create cap space next season. The only big walking bag of money we could tap would be Russell Gage, who would amount to $10 million in cap space (though $6 million in dead cap) if we designated him a post June-1 cut.
Outside of that, we have $47 million in cap space. Overthecap estimates we need around $10 million to sign our rookie class at our current draft slots, so drop our warchest to $37 million.
We NEED to bring back Evans and AWJ, imo. If we resign Baker for market rate (OverTheCap values him at $33mil/yr), you may as well kiss one or both of those guys goodbye, as well as any outside free agebt you may have heard of.
I like Baker as a human and I wish him well, but a better TEAM would undoubtedly be one without an expensive QB who singlehandedly torpedos our finances next season.
Someone needs to make a pic of McCarthy in a Buccaneers uniform.
I genuinely have a feeling that unless Jim Harbaugh was his coach in the NFL, McCarthy will be a bust. He has problems throwing to the right. I don't like his deep pass. I think I read his weight is under 200 pounds? Yikes, Vea would kill him. The good news is there is buzz that if Jim is coming back to the NFL it would be there year and he would make McCarthy his #1 pick.
Nix, I wouldn't mind. If we switched to more of an RPO that would certainly help Rachaad White. Would still need a better interior
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Mccarthy’s grades by depth and direction. Right side throws highlighted.
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- Babeinbucland
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Didn't Mahomes just win a Super Bowl? On his fat contract? Without Tyreek?
Hmmmm....mysteries
Edit: I assume Bootz was not agreeing with Cannon.
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Not at all. This myth that you can't win with a big money QB is just that. Last 3 QBs to win a ring all had large salaries (Brady,Stafford and Mahomes).Terry Tate wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 9:41 pmDidn't Mahomes just win a Super Bowl? On his fat contract? Without Tyreek?
Hmmmm....mysteries
Edit: I assume Bootz was not agreeing with Cannon.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
Absolutely not.
He was certainly distracted and run down, and not peak Tom. There’s no denying that, but holding them back? No way. Seriously, go read up on the time line of shit that went sideways with this team. Nevermind the off the field issues he dealt with, look what he had to work with on the field.
The team was absolutely decimated top to bottom, but especially on offense. It started with Marpet before Brady even came back, then Jensen, then Gronk, then the WR room, then the D, then Wirfs. The hits just kept on coming. It was less than a shell of the 20 and 21 teams. Oh, and lest we forget there was a new HC and Leftwich was a disaster.
If anything Brady was the primary reason they were able to win the division. Even with the division being trash it took some vintage Brady late game heroics to get some of those wins.
I’m curious who you, or anyone else, actually think would have actually done
more with last year’s dumpster fire.
- Babeinbucland
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
I think with all that was going on with him, it impacted the team immensely and we were so chaotic because of it. Not sure who could have done better and not sure who would have done worse. But he play was GOAT play last year for sure.
I said what I said
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
If Bo Nix is gone as this mock draft says. I would not be unhappy with LAIATU LATU
https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl ... en-daniels
https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl ... en-daniels
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
kaimaru wrote: ↑Sat Jan 06, 2024 3:39 am If Bo Nix is gone as this mock draft says. I would not be unhappy with LAIATU LATU
https://www.pff.com/news/draft-2024-nfl ... en-daniels
Who is the defensive slot technician in this draft?
Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
If it wasn't, he be playing this year.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
1st question... No. He can't carry anyone to anything. Let's not pretend that during that heater you brought up, that the defense didn't have 10 take aways.Backside wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:13 pmSo is Flacco capable of carrying a team to a Super Bowl or is he not? He is not the only QB to look mediocre and then go on a heater in the playoffs. So can you win with these guys or can't you? Seems like the goal posts keep moving.CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:04 pm
In the playoffs? That ONE year? Yeah... how about every other game that year or other years there? He was an average QB who didn't f' it up. I mean, good for him. Nothing wrong with that. We all know that average QB's can have great games... even below average QB's. Look at Nick Foles in the 2017 Super Bowl... even the NFCCG that year. Heck, in one other season he threw what, 7 TD passes against Oakland. That year, he threw 27 TD's and only 2 INT's. Let's not pretend that someone is better than what they are because of an isolated incident.
Flacco's best passer rating in any year was under 94. Nick Foles in one season had a 119. LOL
Joe Flacco 2012 playoffs... completed 58%, passes for 1140 yards and 11 TD's (4 games), had a 117.2 passer rating.
Nick Foles 2017 playoffs... completed 72%, passes for 971 yards and 6 TD's, 1 Int (3 games), had a 115.7 passer rating,
Let's also not pretend that in the 6 years following, after Flcco got paid, his numbers didn't really change, yet they made the playoffs only once with him under center.
Not moving any goal posts as when talking about Mayfield, we're talking about giving him an extension... meaning, paying him starter money.
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Re: Welcome Baker Mayfield
1st question... No. He can't carry anyone to anything. Let's not pretend that during that heater you brought up, that the defense didn't have 10 take aways.Backside wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:13 pmSo is Flacco capable of carrying a team to a Super Bowl or is he not? He is not the only QB to look mediocre and then go on a heater in the playoffs. So can you win with these guys or can't you? Seems like the goal posts keep moving.CannonFire wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2024 3:04 pm
In the playoffs? That ONE year? Yeah... how about every other game that year or other years there? He was an average QB who didn't f' it up. I mean, good for him. Nothing wrong with that. We all know that average QB's can have great games... even below average QB's. Look at Nick Foles in the 2017 Super Bowl... even the NFCCG that year. Heck, in one other season he threw what, 7 TD passes against Oakland. That year, he threw 27 TD's and only 2 INT's. Let's not pretend that someone is better than what they are because of an isolated incident.
Flacco's best passer rating in any year was under 94. Nick Foles in one season had a 119. LOL
Joe Flacco 2012 playoffs... completed 58%, passes for 1140 yards and 11 TD's (4 games), had a 117.2 passer rating.
Nick Foles 2017 playoffs... completed 72%, passes for 971 yards and 6 TD's, 1 Int (3 games), had a 115.7 passer rating,
Let's also not pretend that in the 6 years following, after Flcco got paid, his numbers didn't really change, yet they made the playoffs only once with him under center.
2nd question... yes, you can if you have an elite team arounf him. That generally only happens when the qb is cheap, because the other players are getting paid.
Not moving any goal posts as when talking about Mayfield, we're talking about giving him an extension... meaning, paying him starter money.