Rapid Reactions Week 10 29-19 Loss

[King Bootz]

Here is some hard reality. WFT beat us today. They won. They outplayed us. It's really as simple as that. It's the absolute hardest thing for fans to accept. People want the answer to always be "we lost" more than "they beat us". We didn't lose this game. The other team won. It happens. Deal with it, learn from it, and move on.

[13F11B]

Here is some hard reality. WFT beat us today. They won. They outplayed us. It's really as simple as that. It's the absolute hardest thing for fans to accept. People want the answer to always be "we lost" more than "they beat us". We didn't lose this game. The other team won. It happens. Deal with it, learn from it, and move on.

I agree they beat us today. They took away what we want to do on offense. They abused on defense. There were some bad calls but they did not affect the outcome of the game.

[LavonteDavid54]

5 sacks in a game don't matter if you can't get off the damn field on defense.

We lost the turnover battle, we lost time of possession, we lost on third down. It's hard to win when that's the case.

Two straight losses, by nine to the Saints and by ten to the WFT. Hopefully not the start of a trend, but a loss to the Giants next week would no longer surprise me.

On defense, we need to play big-on-big and speed-on-speed. Line up and beat the man across from you, contest fucking routes, don't waste your time guarding grass. Stop dropping defensive linemen into short zones who get abused in pass coverage by in-breaking routes five to ten yards behind them.

On offense, throw the ball to Mike Evans, for fuck's sake. He has had 41 touches on the year. Nine of those were touchdowns, 30 for first downs. That's right; Mike Evans gets a touchdown or first down on 95% of his touches. Today we threw the ball to Leonard Fourette nine times, Chris Godwin eight, Tyler Johnson five, Cam Brate and Giovanni Bernard had three targets apiece. Mike Evans had three targets, one of which was a throw into the dirt at his feet, and his two receptions and touchdown directly led to over half of our total points. Other teams can find ways to feed their top targets, but we let Mike rot on the vine.

Good coaches put their players in positions to succeed. Look at our roster and ask yourselves who is being put into those positions.

I'm not salty. You're salty.

I’ll piggy back off Cheb’s take and the take someone said about being overrated on D and relying on Brady magic and when it don’t happen you get what we’ve seen lately.

That said, and this is where I’m on an island and I’m okay with it. I still think we should build the team around the run game. Always have !! Just not 1st down and anything less than 4 yrds. Just mix it up a bit but let the OLINE who are the TRUE STRENGTH of this team besides Brady do what they like and LOVE to do. Which is SMASH guys in the mouth!!

The style we played with last January n into the SB is OUR STRENGTH!!! Idk why we IGNORE that & have to chase stats and style points ! Look at the correlation between rush attempts , wins and defensive performance going back to Jameis. In 35 yrs I’ve seen defenses cave by late 4th 95% of the time when the big guys upfront pound on them all game. I just think IF you have the pieces to play the formula that’s worked 90% of the time for the last 100 years, you USE IT!! Top 5 run blocking line and…oh btw..a #4 overall pick at his peak in the backfield , who gets stronger with more touches .

I think with weapons banged up and an underperforming defense , what better time ???

[Jason Bourne]

@ATrain we've talked about this. With that said you know why I'm doing this. You're getting a sammich bud. I'm going to take a few minutes to think about how long and give you a chance to see it.

Edit: See you in a week. Sammich gets served hot and fresh at 4:30

Edit: I lied... I did it at 4:28

-LV

I can’t stand the guy but sry this is over moderation imo

[Jason Bourne]

I didn’t see the game but D Whites stats are like he was a beast ?

[Terry Tate]

@ATrain we've talked about this. With that said you know why I'm doing this. You're getting a sammich bud. I'm going to take a few minutes to think about how long and give you a chance to see it.

Edit: See you in a week. Sammich gets served hot and fresh at 4:30

Edit: I lied... I did it at 4:28

-LV

I can’t stand the guy but sry this is over moderation imo

Atrain/Lugz is the only guy Ive ever blocked, anywhere, on any platform. And I've been around for a minute.

It was overdue.

[mdb1958]

I can’t stand the guy but sry this is over moderation imo

Atrain/Lugz is the only guy Ive ever blocked, anywhere, on any platform. And I've been around for a minute.

It was overdue.

I wonder if he is realbucsfan

[Jason Bourne]

I can’t stand the guy but sry this is over moderation imo

Atrain/Lugz is the only guy Ive ever blocked, anywhere, on any platform. And I've been around for a minute.

It was overdue.

The guy post the most stupid stuff ever, but just opinion less moderation is better, but imma a former hippie born 10 years too late. #freedom peace love and happiness

[mdb1958]

On the PI in the endzone (Delaney?), seemed to me it was as the ball whizzed 5 yards overhead.

[mdb1958]

White had some good plays - almost as many as his bad plays

[mdb1958]

I see a pattern of two collective groups.

Tom, Byron, the WR's, the RB's.

Opposing defenses.


Narrative! No Tom we are not going to allow that. All of you will look bad for most of the plays of the game.

[mdb1958]

Now the defense.

Winning one or two downs (with celebration) and losing the third and maybe fourth, makes you the loser.

They seem real late to the party with this understanding.

One could call it being stupid.

[Jason Bourne]

No sense of urgency

[mdb1958]

5 sacks in a game don't matter if you can't get off the damn field on defense.

We lost the turnover battle, we lost time of possession, we lost on third down. It's hard to win when that's the case.

Two straight losses, by nine to the Saints and by ten to the WFT. Hopefully not the start of a trend, but a loss to the Giants next week would no longer surprise me.

On defense, we need to play big-on-big and speed-on-speed. Line up and beat the man across from you, contest fucking routes, don't waste your time guarding grass. Stop dropping defensive linemen into short zones who get abused in pass coverage by in-breaking routes five to ten yards behind them.

On offense, throw the ball to Mike Evans, for fuck's sake. He has had 41 touches on the year. Nine of those were touchdowns, 30 for first downs. That's right; Mike Evans gets a touchdown or first down on 95% of his touches. Today we threw the ball to Leonard Fourette nine times, Chris Godwin eight, Tyler Johnson five, Cam Brate and Giovanni Bernard had three targets apiece. Mike Evans had three targets, one of which was a throw into the dirt at his feet, and his two receptions and touchdown directly led to over half of our total points. Other teams can find ways to feed their top targets, but we let Mike rot on the vine.

Good coaches put their players in positions to succeed. Look at our roster and ask yourselves who is being put into those positions.

I'm not salty. You're salty.

I’ll piggy back off Cheb’s take and the take someone said about being overrated on D and relying on Brady magic and when it don’t happen you get what we’ve seen lately.

That said, and this is where I’m on an island and I’m okay with it. I still think we should build the team around the run game. Always have !! Just not 1st down and anything less than 4 yrds. Just mix it up a bit but let the OLINE who are the TRUE STRENGTH of this team besides Brady do what they like and LOVE to do. Which is SMASH guys in the mouth!!

The style we played with last January n into the SB is OUR STRENGTH!!! Idk why we IGNORE that & have to chase stats and style points ! Look at the correlation between rush attempts , wins and defensive performance going back to Jameis. In 35 yrs I’ve seen defenses cave by late 4th 95% of the time when the big guys upfront pound on them all game. I just think IF you have the pieces to play the formula that’s worked 90% of the time for the last 100 years, you USE IT!! Top 5 run blocking line and…oh btw..a #4 overall pick at his peak in the backfield , who gets stronger with more touches .

I think with weapons banged up and an underperforming defense , what better time ???

Just a quick look at Mikes stats and I see that many of his (over 100 yard games were losses).

I would like to know how many INT's went to trying to get Mike the ball (my guess is that too is also high).

[mdb1958]

@LavonteDavid54 I would add to your post the 11 TFL's and 8 Hurries that went to waste.

I've been around football for 60 years and I don't know why they cannot play a complete game. Just about any other time, that's a blow-out for other teams.

[mdb1958]

What we are showing is, how to let a team go one for three, one for four, and win a game.

[mdb1958]

It's funny, here I am wanting a team record in scoring, wanting 9 successful drives but instead I get 2.

[Capsaicin]

This garbage Mike Smith coverage only works if you can get home with 4 DL and can score 30. Blitzing with it is stupid.

Cant wait til the playoffs when Bowles breaks out the actual defense

[Buc2]

That was an all around pathetic performance. Seems no one came to play.

[BJJ34]

So this isn't a rapid reaction, but it is a reaction...

Is anyone else alarmed at all that our #1(#2 now in rankings) run defense could not stop the run at the end of that game? They beat us with a mix of run/pass on that last drive but it was 13/6. Gibson ran physical too.

Also, can we get Delaney off the field? I don't believe that kid will ever line up and play football again after this season. He's looked less than subpar.

Gronk was missed in our run game. He's the best blocking TE on the roster, and he could have chipped on some of those plays and been an outlet for Tom. Instead, we had Brate and... wait where did Tanner Hudson go? OJ? You mean the killer? I've never seen an OJ Howard before...

To think we would have been down 16-3 going into halftime if not for Mike Evans being a freak and bating a dude into grabbing his facemask(Mike grabbed his too, that wasn't called).

[Dread]

I see alot of fans mentioning we're playing too soft on defense, which I agree with fwiw. I'd guess Bowles is trying to protect his CBs out there b/c he has guys like Russ Cockrell and Dee Delaney.

The first TD the WFT scored was when we blitzed (Devin showed early on the hard count and Heinicke knew he had 1v1 on that post-corner route to Carter #1).

Just sayin, we don't have the CBs right now to play very aggressive.

Hopefully we can get CD3-SMB-Dean out there together again at some point this season. Not that it would guarantee anything, but it gives us the best chance playing the type of defense we did in the playoffs last season.

Because right now we're not beating anyone unless the Bucs offense puts up 30+ pts. Opposing defenses are starting to give us the KC/Mahomes treatment playing alot of 2-high shell which makes it tough to get big plays in the passing game, which in turn makes scoring alot of points tougher.

[Al Bundy]

On the PI in the endzone (Delaney?), seemed to me it was as the ball whizzed 5 yards overhead.

It was uncatchable, but the ref threw the flag before the ball was even in the end zone.

[King Bootz]

I'll say it over and over, fans blame coaching because they truly don't know how to process what's going on during the game. Want proof? Half of the board yesterday were saying we blitzed too much, the other half were saying we played Mike Smith soft. Those are 2 completely different things. So which is it?

What did I see on defense? Nothing terrible. Washington played better. They did a great job executing. If there were more true football fans they would've been able to appreciate the way Washington played yesterday. Their receivers caught a lot of contested catches, did well hanging on to the ball for the most part. Our defense wasn't soft. We forced Heinicke to get rid of the ball fast.

Just because you lose doesn't mean you did something wrong as a team. It's not something fans will understand but I've been saying it for years. The other team is trying to win too. And yesterday Washington won.

[IronDog]

I see alot of fans mentioning we're playing too soft on defense, which I agree with fwiw. I'd guess Bowles is trying to protect his CBs out there b/c he has guys like Russ Cockrell and Dee Delaney.

The first TD the WFT scored was when we blitzed (Devin showed early on the hard count and Heinicke knew he had 1v1 on that post-corner route to Carter #1).

Just sayin, we don't have the CBs right now to play very aggressive.

Hopefully we can get CD3-SMB-Dean out there together again at some point this season. Not that it would guarantee anything, but it gives us the best chance playing the type of defense we did in the playoffs last season.

Because right now we're not beating anyone unless the Bucs offense puts up 30+ pts. Opposing defenses are starting to give us the KC/Mahomes treatment playing alot of 2-high shell which makes it tough to get big plays in the passing game, which in turn makes scoring alot of points tougher.

The road grader that turned the defense on last season just went down with a suspected knee injury, after having returned from an Achilles issue. Can't say the DB shortfall has been as much of a problem as losing Vita likely will be going forward.

[Dread]

I see alot of fans mentioning we're playing too soft on defense, which I agree with fwiw. I'd guess Bowles is trying to protect his CBs out there b/c he has guys like Russ Cockrell and Dee Delaney.

The first TD the WFT scored was when we blitzed (Devin showed early on the hard count and Heinicke knew he had 1v1 on that post-corner route to Carter #1).

Just sayin, we don't have the CBs right now to play very aggressive.

Hopefully we can get CD3-SMB-Dean out there together again at some point this season. Not that it would guarantee anything, but it gives us the best chance playing the type of defense we did in the playoffs last season.

Because right now we're not beating anyone unless the Bucs offense puts up 30+ pts. Opposing defenses are starting to give us the KC/Mahomes treatment playing alot of 2-high shell which makes it tough to get big plays in the passing game, which in turn makes scoring alot of points tougher.

The road grader that turned the defense on last season just went down with a suspected knee injury, after having returned from an Achilles issue. Can't say the DB shortfall has been as much of a problem as losing Vita likely will be going forward.

Meh. Vea wasn't doing much as pass rusher since early in the season and we still have McClendon on the roster (who is obviously not the player Vea is).

Our run defense even with Vea has been pretty average (at time below average) since the 2nd half in Philly so that's 3.5 games worth of data. I get we held WFT to just 2.8 YPC yesterday, but a good run defense doesn't give up 19 play drives to ice the game like we did in the 4th qtr. Vea was out there for that.

I'm not saying we won't miss Vea. We're certainly better with him than without. I'm just saying we've played good defense without him before.

On the flipside we'll never play the aggressive type of defense we need to with the guys like Cockrell and Delaney being 2 of out 3 starting CBs when we're in nickel. You can't leave subpar CBs like that 1v1 vs NFL WRs and expect not get burned.

TL;DR - Getting our top 3 CBs back healthy is more of a factor to playing better defense than having Vea imo.

[Dread]

I'll say it over and over, fans blame coaching because they truly don't know how to process what's going on during the game. Want proof? Half of the board yesterday were saying we blitzed too much, the other half were saying we played Mike Smith soft. Those are 2 completely different things. So which is it?

What did I see on defense? Nothing terrible. Washington played better. They did a great job executing. If there were more true football fans they would've been able to appreciate the way Washington played yesterday. Their receivers caught a lot of contested catches, did well hanging on to the ball for the most part. Our defense wasn't soft. We forced Heinicke to get rid of the ball fast.

Just because you lose doesn't mean you did something wrong as a team. It's not something fans will understand but I've been saying it for years. The other team is trying to win too. And yesterday Washington won.

All the credit to WFT. But this is a Bucs message board so fans are going to focus on the Bucs. Especially after a frustrating loss like that one.

WFT executed well and Heinicke is turning into another Eli Manning/Nick Foles type who seems to get inspired playing against Brady.

Defensively I think we got outcoached a tad. Maybe we're too predictable at time b/c we want to protect our weaker CBs but they seemed to have the 'right' playcall more often than not which reflects on the playcallers.

But WFT executed better for sure. Multiple clutch 3rd down conversions on perfectly times out-routes or that slant late to McLaurin is held onto.

[The Outsider]

I say let ATrain/LUGZ stay…he dumb, but he fun.

I'm not going to open the can of worms on whether or not he meant that maliciously. But this is the same as a bartender cutting off the guy who has clearly had too much to drink. And it's not like much of the board hasn't noticed. I won't punish a guy for loving his team but he said he'd be gone and I'm simply going to give it to him for a while.

-LV

Feels like I'm back on the TBBBBBBBBBBBBBBB!

[The Outsider]

I'll say it over and over, fans blame coaching because they truly don't know how to process what's going on during the game. Want proof? Half of the board yesterday were saying we blitzed too much, the other half were saying we played Mike Smith soft. Those are 2 completely different things. So which is it?

What did I see on defense? Nothing terrible. Washington played better. They did a great job executing. If there were more true football fans they would've been able to appreciate the way Washington played yesterday. Their receivers caught a lot of contested catches, did well hanging on to the ball for the most part. Our defense wasn't soft. We forced Heinicke to get rid of the ball fast.

Just because you lose doesn't mean you did something wrong as a team. It's not something fans will understand but I've been saying it for years. The other team is trying to win too. And yesterday Washington won.

You can blitz heavily and simultaneously play soft coverage. Our CBs are playing way off the LOS a ton whether we blitz or not, which is unsurprising because outside of Dean we're fielding a bunch of practice squad guys.

[King Bootz]

Good news but Greg can miss me with the last part. The Bucs not putting Gronk or AB on IR was supposed to be signs that they'd be back in less than 3 weeks. But 2 months later.....

[Central_Buc]

Better to Struggle now and (hopefully) get hot later.

[Dread]

Good news but Greg can miss me with the last part. The Bucs not putting Gronk or AB on IR was supposed to be signs that they'd be back in less than 3 weeks. But 2 months later.....

Yeah, but the Vea injury not being season ending is still good news and was a pleasant surprise.

Let the big man rest up for a month and bring him back for the last 3-4 games if he's ready.

Getting healthy and playing well those last few games so we head into the playoffs the right way is still the #1 priority of the regular season imo. Having the #1 seed would be nice also, but at the end of the day if we're a healthy roster and playing well with Tom Brady as our QB in the playoffs, I like our chances to make a run.

[Kress]

Just because you lose doesn't mean you did something wrong as a team. It's not something fans will understand but I've been saying it for years. The other team is trying to win too. And yesterday Washington won.

I get that you're trying to be the voice of reason, and they're all pros out there, blah, blah, blah.

But in this case, the Bucs losing does mean they did something wrong. The Bucs are the better team. If the Bucs played as well as the Football Folks played, the Bucs win. The Bucs did not play as good of a game, so they lost.

You can give credit to the other team all you want, even if it is deserved, but when you lose to a lesser opponent, that's on you.

[nybf]

So this isn't a rapid reaction, but it is a reaction...

Is anyone else alarmed at all that our #1(#2 now in rankings) run defense could not stop the run at the end of that game?

Been a few weeks since we could actually stop the run, so no. No surprise here.

[The Outsider]

So this isn't a rapid reaction, but it is a reaction...

Is anyone else alarmed at all that our #1(#2 now in rankings) run defense could not stop the run at the end of that game?

Been a few weeks since we could actually stop the run, so no. No surprise here.

Also, our defense is awful at getting off the field on 3rd down, run or pass. So by the end of the game they're all gassed. Especially when the offense is playing like shit and isn't sustaining drives itself. Not a shock that they gave up that long drive at the end after being on the field for 30+ minutes.

That's something I haven't seen mentioned here once. Time of possession. They doubled ours. You can't give the opposing team the ball for almost 40 minutes of a 60 minute game, lose the TO battle, and expect to win, ever.

[IchabodCrane84]

Good news but Greg can miss me with the last part. The Bucs not putting Gronk or AB on IR was supposed to be signs that they'd be back in less than 3 weeks. But 2 months later.....

The fact that he came back last year gives me encouragement that he's a fast healer like Lavonte.