Flores suing the NFL

[Snake]

Rekt’d

[13F11B]

Add this to what Elway said.

[Snake]

Flores gonna come out of this looking awful.

[nybf]

I like threads like this because people get real comfortable and tell on themselves.

[Snake]

Does Elway have a bad reputation? This would seem out of character for him, based on what I know.

[13F11B]

Does Elway have a bad reputation? This would seem out of character for him, based on what I know.

Not really sure. I never paid too much attention to Elway. However, a quick Google search seems to indicate he was often seen drunk.

https://brobible.com/sports/article/joh ... ody-paige/

[Dread]

Flores gonna come out of this looking awful.

Meh.. Don't be so sure. He's got alot of the woke sports media (like ESPN) behind him and b/c this is a race issue people won't pay attention to facts or details. They've already convinced themselves of what they know to be true here regardless of what information comes forth.

Flores calls Elway a drunk in the lawsuit b/c looked drowsy in the interview, smearing yet another NFL franchise in a baseless claim (just like the Giants).

Now it's revealed Elway and his team took a red-eye to Providence, RI so they could interview Flores a few hours later and I'd bet none of the "Team Flores" folks moved off their position an inch. Flores is a victim and thus the facts are irrelevant.

[Snake]

Yeah, I should’ve specified. Awful to those who look past the surface level of the headlines.

[Dread]

Does Elway have a bad reputation? This would seem out of character for him, based on what I know.

Not really sure. I never paid too much attention to Elway. However, a quick Google search seems to indicate he was often seen drunk.

https://brobible.com/sports/article/joh ... ody-paige/

It's like the Brett Kavanaugh confirmation. You drink beer therefore you must be guilty of whatever terrible thing you're accused of.

Flores lawyers smeared Elway and Flores let it happen b/c that was collateral damage in what Flores believes is serving a higher cause.

[nybf]

People are getting really comfortable in here. Won't be too long until someone just straight up drops the N word.

[Snake]

You seem to be in your feelings. What’s going on?

[acmillis]

Was really wishing the last sentence of that Elway statement went something along the lines of, "I thank the good lord above we went in another direction."

[Dread]

Totally need to believe some fuck hole 800 followers.

And the greatest race baiter since Bootz endorsing her? Gots to be true. That Cunt is so salty her ESPN show didn't last as long as lilBJ getting a teeth mold.

Flores is a very good coach and has credibility. Hue is a fucking imbecile and has none.

Yeah, I don't think Hue Jackson interjecting here helps Flores. Unless he's actually does have some type of evidence to provide.

Hue Jackson is fucking terrible football coach. That Browns team was awful because they consistently drafted terrible players in the first round. Look at that 2014 draft that was loaded with great players, the Browns trade down from 4 to 9 and every pick between 5th overall to 17th overall became a future pro-bowler except who the Browns drafted.

16 of the top 25 overall picks in that class become pro bowlers. The Browns had 2 of the 9 picks who did not. Amazing!!!

Plus the Browns brass at the time (Sashi, Berry, etc) are all very intelligent dudes, the idea there is documentation of something they know would get them banned from the sport seems tough to believe on the surface.

Not to mention Sashi Brown and Andrew Berry are both black dudes like Hue. So the whole 'have the black man take the fall' seems pretty sensationalized.

[acmillis]

Hue was asked point blank - Were you paid/incentivized to lose games at Cleveland.

His response - Well...ummmm...what I'd say is there was a four year plan...and we didn't have a lot of talent on those teams...so we were not put in a place to win.

Not sure why he's wanting the spotlight, but that sounds quite normal for a rebuilding team/franchise.

[Primeminister]

Hue was asked point blank - Were you paid/incentivized to lose games at Cleveland.

His response - Well...ummmm...what I'd say is there was a four year plan...and we didn't have a lot of talent on those teams...so we were not put in a place to win.

Not sure why he's wanting the spotlight, but that sounds quite normal for a rebuilding team/franchise.

You’re leaving out a couple key points. Hue said the incentives for the first two years were based on things like accumulating draft picks and having the youngest team in the league. He rightly said those incentives don’t match with winning football games. Also to be fair to the Browns the incentives in year 3 were based on winning X number of games.

Here is the interview if anyone wants to see it.

[Dread]

I like threads like this because people get real comfortable and tell on themselves.

People are getting really comfortable in here. Won't be too long until someone just straight up drops the N word.

It was such a great contribution the first time you really didn't need to echo it less than an hour later. But the mention of the "N word" does add dramatic effect.

We get it, if someone doesn't believe #TeamFlores they are a racist, amirite?

[nybf]

I like threads like this because people get real comfortable and tell on themselves.

People are getting really comfortable in here. Won't be too long until someone just straight up drops the N word.

It was such a great contribution the first time you really didn't need to echo it less than an hour later. But the mention of the "N word" does add dramatic effect.

We get it, if someone doesn't believe #TeamFlores they are a racist, amirite?

I said it again less than an hour later because people were getting even more comfortable.

You're not a racist if you don't believe Flores. However, if you dismiss what he says as hearsay, immediately accept the same hearsay from others, and litter your posts with bullshit like "woke" and "sjw", there are some red flags there.

[Terry Tate]

I don't know about racist job interviews. Everything we are going to get out of this will be hearsay and I never believe that. The Belichick texts elevated the whole thing to the highest level of comedy though.

All I will say is that Steven Ross looks like a real POS. I always though something didn't pass the smell test when they let Flores go, now we see what it was.

[Sdbucs]

I like threads like this because people get real comfortable and tell on themselves.

People are getting really comfortable in here. Won't be too long until someone just straight up drops the N word.

It was such a great contribution the first time you really didn't need to echo it less than an hour later. But the mention of the "N word" does add dramatic effect.

We get it, if someone doesn't believe #TeamFlores they are a racist, amirite?

The dude is literally insinuating that if you disagree with Flores/question the woke narrative that you’re getting “comfortable” and about to expose your true racist beliefs.

Brainwashed moron honestly

[Terry Tate]

People are getting really comfortable in here. Won't be too long until someone just straight up drops the N word.

It's ok, I can use it. I have some black friends.


Plus, as a Sicilian, I am part black anyway according to Dennis Hopper.

[nybf]

It was such a great contribution the first time you really didn't need to echo it less than an hour later. But the mention of the "N word" does add dramatic effect.

We get it, if someone doesn't believe #TeamFlores they are a racist, amirite?

The dude is literally insinuating that if you disagree with Flores/question the woke narrative that you’re getting “comfortable” and about to expose your true racist beliefs.

Brainwashed moron honestly

The dude literally explained what he meant.

Go tongue fuck another truck.

[acmillis]

Hue was asked point blank - Were you paid/incentivized to lose games at Cleveland.

His response - Well...ummmm...what I'd say is there was a four year plan...and we didn't have a lot of talent on those teams...so we were not put in a place to win.

Not sure why he's wanting the spotlight, but that sounds quite normal for a rebuilding team/franchise.

You’re leaving out a couple key points. Hue said the incentives for the first two years were based on things like accumulating draft picks and having the youngest team in the league. He rightly said those incentives don’t match with winning football games. Also to be fair to the Browns the incentives in year 3 were based on winning X number of games.

Here is the interview if anyone wants to see it.

He was not paid incentives to lose, so either he’s lying, or the media is running with a bad headline

[kaimaru]

Of course the league is fucked up. Everyone is getting rich on CTE bloodmoney. Billionaires are fucked up as a general rule. The Rooney rule has good intentions. But it’s just another way of trying to overcome implicit bias and has obvious flaws.

I don’t have a ton of sympathy for Flores regardless. He became wealthy by the same system. He’s continued to receive interview opportunities. He can be butt hurt about the team having preferences and word getting around the league about that, but he’s still getting interviewed. It’s on him to change that preference. Not the team to miraculously not form preferences as they do the interview process. Belichick has deep roots in the Giants organization still. Some equipment manager could’ve heard something and sent him a text. It’s really hard to say how he became privy to the Daboll information. If the fear is Rooney candidates being token, maybe they should be required to interview those people first. If that’s the case, why aren’t we just mandating that teams hire minority coaches, because we’re one step away from that at that point.

The being paid to tank thing is a non-story, unless he has evidence. And even with evidence, it’s mostly problematic because of the gambling implications and the bad optics of a team trying to suck. Even though we all know in a cap locked pro sport, being bad is usually a required bus stop before being good. And the treadmill mediocre teams are where you don’t want to be. The owner stands to make more money by making his team good long-term and increasing the value of his franchise than unscrupulous gambling tactics for 16 games.

Every year there are some teams who clearly do not plan on competing at the highest levels. it seems to be working for the league because it puts them in positions to get good quarterbacks on rookie deals and turn the ship around.

Brian Flores says he has proof. Are you also discounting the fact that the Browns owners told Hue Jackson to tank for 2 years, and Roger Goodell told him to sign a non-disclosure agreement and pics of it is posted online? Goodell said it would damage the reputation of the NFL. When the commissioner of the league says "go ahead and tank, we don't care that you're breaking a federal law for two years" is a non-story?

18 U.S. Code § 224 - Bribery in sporting contests
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/224

[Primeminister]

Of course the league is fucked up. Everyone is getting rich on CTE bloodmoney. Billionaires are fucked up as a general rule. The Rooney rule has good intentions. But it’s just another way of trying to overcome implicit bias and has obvious flaws.

I don’t have a ton of sympathy for Flores regardless. He became wealthy by the same system. He’s continued to receive interview opportunities. He can be butt hurt about the team having preferences and word getting around the league about that, but he’s still getting interviewed. It’s on him to change that preference. Not the team to miraculously not form preferences as they do the interview process. Belichick has deep roots in the Giants organization still. Some equipment manager could’ve heard something and sent him a text. It’s really hard to say how he became privy to the Daboll information. If the fear is Rooney candidates being token, maybe they should be required to interview those people first. If that’s the case, why aren’t we just mandating that teams hire minority coaches, because we’re one step away from that at that point.

The being paid to tank thing is a non-story, unless he has evidence. And even with evidence, it’s mostly problematic because of the gambling implications and the bad optics of a team trying to suck. Even though we all know in a cap locked pro sport, being bad is usually a required bus stop before being good. And the treadmill mediocre teams are where you don’t want to be. The owner stands to make more money by making his team good long-term and increasing the value of his franchise than unscrupulous gambling tactics for 16 games.

Every year there are some teams who clearly do not plan on competing at the highest levels. it seems to be working for the league because it puts them in positions to get good quarterbacks on rookie deals and turn the ship around.

Brian Flores says he has proof. Are you also discounting the fact that the Browns owners told Hue Jackson to tank for 2 years, and Roger Goodell told him to sign a non-disclosure agreement and pics of it is posted online? Goodell said it would damage the reputation of the NFL. When the commissioner of the league says "go ahead and tank, we don't care that you're breaking a federal law for two years" is a non-story?

18 U.S. Code § 224 - Bribery in sporting contests
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/224

Can you post a link to these pics?

[Sdbucs]

The dude is literally insinuating that if you disagree with Flores/question the woke narrative that you’re getting “comfortable” and about to expose your true racist beliefs.

Brainwashed moron honestly

The dude literally explained what he meant.

Go tongue fuck another truck.

Always funny when the retard gets called out on his dumbass antics and gets defensive.

Goes from “getting really comfortable *smiley face*”

To “go tongue fuck another truck”

Lmfao. Loser

[nybf]

The dude literally explained what he meant.

Go tongue fuck another truck.

Always funny when the retard gets called out on his dumbass antics and gets defensive.

Goes from “getting really comfortable *smiley face*”

To “go tongue fuck another truck”

Lmfao. Loser

Everyone knows you're a racist POS. We don't need this conversation to prove it. Not a surprise you came running to join in, though.

It really is too bad the truck didn't finish the job.

[Sdbucs]

Always funny when the retard gets called out on his dumbass antics and gets defensive.

Goes from “getting really comfortable *smiley face*”

To “go tongue fuck another truck”

Lmfao. Loser

Everyone knows you're a racist POS. We don't need this conversation to prove it. Not a surprise you came running to join in, though.

It really is too bad the truck didn't finish the job.

“Everyone who disagrees with me is waycis!”

God damn I’m surprised you figured out how to use a computer or whatever it is you’re typing on. Moron

[nybf]

Jfc that's weak. Not even worth my time anymore.

[13F11B]

"The allegation that the Giants' decision had been made prior to Friday evening, January 28, is false," the team said in a statement. "And to base that allegation on a text exchange with Bill Belichick in which he ultimately states that he ‘thinks’ Brian Daboll would get the job is irresponsible. The text exchange occurred the day before Coach Daboll's in-person interview even took place. Giants' ownership would never hire a head coach based only on a 20-minute Zoom interview, which is all that Mr. Daboll had at that point."

source

The Giants are pushing back hard on what Flores has alleged.

[Doctor]

The NFL didn't coin "it's not what you know, it's who you know", but they aren't exempt from it either. Nor the charade of being a "meritocracy".

That's called reality. No organization in human history has ever been immune/exempt from it whether it's government, business, sports etc

There is a fine line between nepotism and networking I suppose and those lines get blurred based on the perspective and/or resentment of the individual. Networking is part of life and you better embrace that early or else it will lead to resentment later.

But let's not pretend Flores doesn't have great network in the NFL and was some type of outsider. A big reason he got that Dolphins job was b/c of his network (Belichick)

The NFL is absolutely a meritocracy. That is the greatest thing about sports in general and why humans love to watch athletic competition. That's not say the "best" candidate always gets the job when it comes to NFL hiring or anything else. But the organizations in any industry who don't have the priority of trying to hire the best candidates will always be outperformed by those who do. So it all washes out.

To bring this back the the NFL and it's hiring practices, what solution is there other that mandated diversity quotas that isn't already being done? The league is literally giving away draft picks.

Should we just award the Super Bowl to the team with most minorities on the coaching staff and FO?

I actually would argue that Flores has a pretty weak network, particularly on the offensive side of the ball. He had like 4 OCs in 3 years.

The hard pill to swallow is that progress is slow. painfully slow. and it doesn't constantly move forward, sometimes you take steps backward. But you can't help someone that doesn't want to be helped. Period.

Change, real change, always needs to come from within. Anyone that tells you the magic bullet it policy is lying. It needs to be in that person's own self-interest to change for the change to be genuine, otherwise you just get more shams. And you'll always have people who resist to the very end, like the Red Sox or the Redskins did, but even they too give way because their hate for losing eventually overcomes their hate of "the other". (Because winning teams make more money) This, of course, speaks to your point about being outperformed by those who are ahead of the times.

Here's the thing, research has shown the innate cognitive bias in humans towards those that look like them. It's literally an evolutionary survival tool. Smart people hear this and think "Okay, what can I do to make sure my subconscious lizard brain biases are not getting in the way of hiring the best possible to achieve our goals". Some CEO's have started doing blind resumes (with names and demographic details removed) and such.

Most people, however, are rather egotistical and overrate their own abilities in general. It's the difference between successful people who set specific and measured goals and people who think they can just "feel" their way to their goals. In this case, hiring managers who think "I'll catch my biases on the fly and correct it" or worse "well I'm not biased so there's nothing to account for".

[Doctor]

Let's be clear.

The NFL workers aren't magically free of innate cognitive biases and given the age of some in powerful positions, it'd be naive to think there were even some explicit biases.

With that said, it's rare for a first-time head coach to jump right back into another head coaching job. There are exceptions to this, some due to being an exceptional coach and some due to some exceptional networking, but by and large, you usually have to fall back in the ranks for a bit before your next chance. Even BB when back to coach DBs after he got fired from Cleveland. I don't think Flores qualifies for either exception.

Now, would Flores's odds of being seen as such have been higher if he was white? Absolutely.
Would a white Flores have been hired as a HC this offseason? Still highly unlikely.

There's also a compound effect to consider, which is often much of the new hirers come from college, who suffer from the same issues. So one of the main pools you draw from is already slanted in a similar fashion. There's a reason the long list of viable black HCs are all retreads.

[BLT]

If Flores was White, and not smeared by the Dolphins and Tua, he would have already been hired. Maybe first.

No doubt.

[13F11B]

If Flores was White, and not smeared by the Dolphins and Tua, he would have already been hired. Maybe first.

No doubt.

There is no honest way to say that. None.

How long did it take Tony Dungy to get a new coaching gig after being fired by the Buccaneers?

How long did it take Marty Schottenheimer to get a new gig after being fired by the Chargers after a 14-2 season?

[BLT]

Umm, Marty retired from the NFL after that and was 100 years old I don't understand the point you are trying to make.

[Doctor]

If Flores was White, and not smeared by the Dolphins and Tua, he would have already been hired. Maybe first.

No doubt.

Fired first times HC rarely get a second HC gig off the bat, unless they are truly exceptional coaches or have an exceptional network.

Which of these two do you think apply to Flores and why?