2022 NFL Coaching/GM Carousel thread

[uscbucsfan]

What? Who? Rich?

And what the fuck difference would that make anyway?

Whoosh

[Buc2]

What? Who? Rich?

And what the fuck difference would that make anyway?

I'm pretty sure he was joking.

[Snake]

So GB is finalizing hiring Rich Bisaccia as their ST coach, after the Raiders opted for McDaniels over the interim HC that took them to the playoffs. So, what is Rich's perceived failings that has kept him as a ST coach for the past 20+ years?

Because sometimes your ceiling is just being a coordinator? The jobs are so different. You have to be good at so many different things to be an effective HC (though having a great QB can cover for a lot of your failings).

[Snake]

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/329 ... -x-os-ceos

Pretty good article. And it’s easy to see how somebody who is only proven to be good at coaching A phase of the game (Xs and Os) can suddenly be in over their head as a CEO type of leader.

[Doctor]

Forget being a black coach, try getting a HC as a ST coach. The only one that comes to mind is Harbaugh.

What Rich did in LV was incredible. Playoffs and double digit wins for a team that only had a winning season once since their SB in 2002. All with crazy distractions.
What the heck more do you want from your team CEO?

[King Bootz]

Forget being a black coach, try getting a HC as a ST coach. The only one that comes to mind is Harbaugh.

What Rich did in LV was incredible. Playoffs and double digit wins for a team that only had a winning season once since their SB in 2002. All with crazy distractions.
What the heck more do you want from your team CEO?

Joe Judge. Dan Campbell (IIRC?)

[13F11B]

Forget being a black coach, try getting a HC as a ST coach. The only one that comes to mind is Harbaugh.

What Rich did in LV was incredible. Playoffs and double digit wins for a team that only had a winning season once since their SB in 2002. All with crazy distractions.
What the heck more do you want from your team CEO?

I thought Rich was a damned good coach when he was with the Buccaneers. I thought he would get a chance at a HC spot and do well. Sadly, despite really doing an excellent job for LV he did not get a shot.

[Swashbuckler]

Pederson and Lovie are stability hires for franchises in disarray.

Lovie's fall here was more his loyalty to Leslie Fraizer who the FO was apparently over on, but he wasn't. Both kept insisting on a scheme that relied too heavily on our weakest personnel group.

Pederson and Lovie?? Stability?? Hilarious.

Pederson was fired because of all of the stability within the Eagles locker room and their QB situation. Lovie went 8-24. Hardly any stability with either situation.

Like not to pick a fight but what could possibly be so bad about Pederson? Guy made the playoffs 3 times with the gimpiest QB in the NFL and won it all with Nick Foles. I can only imagine what this guy is gonna do with Trevor Lawrence. If the Jags play this draft well and the next one (they'll go what, like 5-12?) they can get out of the wilderness. I trust Pederson to figure that situation out.

Lovie, you have a better case for and that's not a hill I'll quite die on. But yet he had us 6-6 in December for the first time in how many years and like 2 of those losses were solely because Kyle Brindza couldn't make a kick to save his life. 8-24 is a shit record that's impossible to defend, but man Lovie got dealt a raw deal. He got hired (probably to tank) and the Glazers rat fucked him for a guy who spent the next 3 years whispering in Winston's ear about how great he was until he believed every word and regressed to his worst impulses; all while never being able to hit DeSean Jackson in stride in 2 years but Fitz could do it on the first try.


Given the shit shows Smith and Pederson are walking into, their stability at worst likens to Tommen following Joffrey to the throne.

[King Bootz]

Pederson and Lovie?? Stability?? Hilarious.

Pederson was fired because of all of the stability within the Eagles locker room and their QB situation. Lovie went 8-24. Hardly any stability with either situation.

Like not to pick a fight but what could possibly be so bad about Pederson? Guy made the playoffs 3 times with the gimpiest QB in the NFL and won it all with Nick Foles. I can only imagine what this guy is gonna do with Trevor Lawrence. If the Jags play this draft well and the next one (they'll go what, like 5-12?) they can get out of the wilderness. I trust Pederson to figure that situation out.

Lovie, you have a better case for and that's not a hill I'll quite die on. But yet he had us 6-6 in December for the first time in how many years and like 2 of those losses were solely because Kyle Brindza couldn't make a kick to save his life. 8-24 is a shit record that's impossible to defend, but man Lovie got dealt a raw deal. He got hired (probably to tank) and the Glazers rat fucked him for a guy who spent the next 3 years whispering in Winston's ear about how great he was until he believed every word and regressed to his worst impulses; all while never being able to hit DeSean Jackson in stride in 2 years but Fitz could do it on the first try.


Given the shit shows Smith and Pederson are walking into, their stability at worst likens to Tommen following Joffrey to the throne.

Wouldn't it strike you odd that a guy made the playoffs 3 out of 5 years and won a Super Bowl was fired? The instability is that locker room is the very thing that led to him being fired. The fallout with Wentz. Players picking sides. That situation got ugly fast. Now I'm supposed to believe he'll stabilize an even bigger mess in Jacksonville? I'll believe it when I see it

[Doctor]

Wouldn't it strike you odd that a guy made the playoffs 3 out of 5 years and won a Super Bowl was fired?

Only if one took the Eagles seriously as an organization, which I don't.

[Swashbuckler]

Like not to pick a fight but what could possibly be so bad about Pederson? Guy made the playoffs 3 times with the gimpiest QB in the NFL and won it all with Nick Foles. I can only imagine what this guy is gonna do with Trevor Lawrence. If the Jags play this draft well and the next one (they'll go what, like 5-12?) they can get out of the wilderness. I trust Pederson to figure that situation out.

Lovie, you have a better case for and that's not a hill I'll quite die on. But yet he had us 6-6 in December for the first time in how many years and like 2 of those losses were solely because Kyle Brindza couldn't make a kick to save his life. 8-24 is a shit record that's impossible to defend, but man Lovie got dealt a raw deal. He got hired (probably to tank) and the Glazers rat fucked him for a guy who spent the next 3 years whispering in Winston's ear about how great he was until he believed every word and regressed to his worst impulses; all while never being able to hit DeSean Jackson in stride in 2 years but Fitz could do it on the first try.


Given the shit shows Smith and Pederson are walking into, their stability at worst likens to Tommen following Joffrey to the throne.

Wouldn't it strike you odd that a guy made the playoffs 3 out of 5 years and won a Super Bowl was fired? The instability is that locker room is the very thing that led to him being fired. The fallout with Wentz. Players picking sides. That situation got ugly fast. Now I'm supposed to believe he'll stabilize an even bigger mess in Jacksonville? I'll believe it when I see it

Well I'm not going to accuse Wentz of being a divisive personality. I wasn't in the locker room so I have no way to prove it. And I won't accuse Pederson of it either because as far as I'm concerned, things fine until Hurts came into the picture. That's where the rift started. When an organization makes those kinds of choices, it takes more than the coach and the locker room to mess things up. But funny enough, Hurts is the one who has made the best of that situation. But between us, Urb is a bigger cancer than all of that and at least him being gone managed to unite almost an entire locker room with almost everyone texting him farewell (and not in a good way) when he was dismissed. But in the end, at you saying "I'll believe it when I see it" at least loans itself to the same grace of Wentz's situation in Indy as well.

[Doctor]

People seriously underrate the incredible importance of cohesion in a front office

[King Bootz]

Wouldn't it strike you odd that a guy made the playoffs 3 out of 5 years and won a Super Bowl was fired? The instability is that locker room is the very thing that led to him being fired. The fallout with Wentz. Players picking sides. That situation got ugly fast. Now I'm supposed to believe he'll stabilize an even bigger mess in Jacksonville? I'll believe it when I see it

Well I'm not going to accuse Wentz of being a divisive personality. I wasn't in the locker room so I have no way to prove it. And I won't accuse Pederson of it either because as far as I'm concerned, things fine until Hurts came into the picture. That's where the rift started. When an organization makes those kinds of choices, it takes more than the coach and the locker room to mess things up. But funny enough, Hurts is the one who has made the best of that situation. But between us, Urb is a bigger cancer than all of that and at least him being gone managed to unite almost an entire locker room with almost everyone texting him farewell (and not in a good way) when he was dismissed. But in the end, at you saying "I'll believe it when I see it" at least loans itself to the same grace of Wentz's situation in Indy as well.

Okay I can buy Pederson being a stabilizing presence in the context of improving an Urban Meyer locker room. He's as toxic as it gets no question.

It's just not every day you see a hire, SB win, 3 playoff appearances and a firing in a 5 year span. That's a huge red flag.

[Primeminister]

So GB is finalizing hiring Rich Bissacia as their ST coach, after the Raiders opted for McDaniels over the interim HC that took them to the playoffs. So, what is Rich's perceived failings that have kept him as a ST coach for the past 20+ years?

I don’t know, but I feel for the guy. As the interim HC in Vegas he proved enough to be given a chance to coach elsewhere. I don’t know what else the man could have done.

[Swashbuckler]

Well I'm not going to accuse Wentz of being a divisive personality. I wasn't in the locker room so I have no way to prove it. And I won't accuse Pederson of it either because as far as I'm concerned, things fine until Hurts came into the picture. That's where the rift started. When an organization makes those kinds of choices, it takes more than the coach and the locker room to mess things up. But funny enough, Hurts is the one who has made the best of that situation. But between us, Urb is a bigger cancer than all of that and at least him being gone managed to unite almost an entire locker room with almost everyone texting him farewell (and not in a good way) when he was dismissed. But in the end, at you saying "I'll believe it when I see it" at least loans itself to the same grace of Wentz's situation in Indy as well.

Okay I can buy Pederson being a stabilizing presence in the context of improving an Urban Meyer locker room. He's as toxic as it gets no question.

It's just not every day you see a hire, SB win, 3 playoff appearances and a firing in a 5 year span. That's a huge red flag.

It is a red flag to a degree to me. At the time it happened the situation to me as a neutral spectator was "Wentz always gets hurt, he's salty about having Hurts as his backup, the team isn't winning. Now the locker room is imploding because Pederson wants to try a new hand at backup and he's had so much success that way already." I thought it was two grown men being petty with each other.

But at the end of the day is was about as toxic as it gets. As you said, wait and see. I think it'll work out for the Jags ONLY if Khan just leaves shit alone. Dude looks like he meddles like a kid playing Madden

[MJW]

Khan has outed himself as a bad owner.

There's a bit more nuance, but that's where we're at. Between trusting Baalke, hiring Meyer, and dicking over Leftwich, it is what it is. Daniel Snyder Lite.

Now there's Doug Pederson, who won a Superbowl, but also oversaw the complete meltdown of the Eagles shortly thereafter. Basically, Bill Callahan if he'd beaten us. A guy who was presumably hired because he was willing to work with Baalke, who seems capital-T Toxic.

I feel for Jags fans, because they do not deserve this. But it's difficult to see this all working out until Khan sells, or at least recuses himself from the day-to-day.

[King Bootz]

Khan has outed himself as a bad owner.

There's a bit more nuance, but that's where we're at. Between trusting Baalke, hiring Meyer, and dicking over Leftwich, it is what it is. Daniel Snyder Lite.

Now there's Doug Pederson, who won a Superbowl, but also oversaw the complete meltdown of the Eagles shortly thereafter. Basically, Bill Callahan if he'd beaten us. A guy who was presumably hired because he was willing to work with Baalke, who seems capital-T Toxic.

I feel for Jags fans, because they do not deserve this. But it's difficult to see this all working out until Khan sells, or at least recuses himself from the day-to-day.

I knew he was a bad owner when the Gus Bradley situation occurred. They play a game on the road and Bradley is fired before the team even leaves the stadium. He had to fly back to Jacksonville as the fired HC with the team. How humiliating that must've been.

[MJW]

Khan has outed himself as a bad owner.

There's a bit more nuance, but that's where we're at. Between trusting Baalke, hiring Meyer, and dicking over Leftwich, it is what it is. Daniel Snyder Lite.

Now there's Doug Pederson, who won a Superbowl, but also oversaw the complete meltdown of the Eagles shortly thereafter. Basically, Bill Callahan if he'd beaten us. A guy who was presumably hired because he was willing to work with Baalke, who seems capital-T Toxic.

I feel for Jags fans, because they do not deserve this. But it's difficult to see this all working out until Khan sells, or at least recuses himself from the day-to-day.

I knew he was a bad owner when the Gus Bradley situation occurred. They play a game on the road and Bradley is fired before the team even leaves the stadium. He had to fly back to Jacksonville as the fired HC with the team. How humiliating that must've been.

Forgot about that. Yeah, Snyder-lite. Extremely bright dude and more money than God but not the slightest idea how to run an NFL franchise. Sucks for their fans. They don't deserve this.g

[13F11B]

Interesting article on the coaching hires.

Lovie Smith | Houston Texans | Grade: F
Mike McDaniel | Miami Dolphins | Grade: D-
Dennis Allen | New Orleans Saints | Grade: D
Matt Eberflus | Chicago Bears | Grade: D+
Nathaniel Hackett | Denver Broncos | Grade: C-
Kevin O’Connell | Minnesota Vikings | Grade: C
Doug Pederson | Philadelphia Eagles | Grade: C+
Brian Daboll | New York Giants | Grade: B
Josh McDaniels | Las Vegas Raiders | Grade: A

Interesting grades on the coaches. Doesn't seem like they like the hires with the exception of Josh McDaniels.

[Snake]

Exercise in futility.

[13F11B]

Exercise in futility.

?

[King Bootz]

I honestly don't get the Josh McDaniels appeal and no one can explain it either. His time on Denver was a disaster from the start. He traded their 2 best players and had issues with them both, the video taping controversy and being let go after 1.5 years. And then the Indy situation was probably worse.

I'm honestly not expecting much from him. I don't see a leader there.

[Doctor]

I'm not a Josh McDaniels fan but I get it. He's run one of the best offenses in New England for years. Yes, I get that people love to discredit anyone that plays with Brady for anything ever, but it's not his fault he got the GOAT and he sure as hell made the most of it. (Though I could argue Brady's numbers with Arians for 13 years would've been insane)

I think what turned it back on for people was watching him take a QB most thought was rather meh and have him lead the #6 ranked offense his first year. A little evidence that it's wasn't all Tom. Yes, his time in Denver was an absolute wreck. He came in too hot and tried to do too much and fell on his face. Though who knows what it could've looked like if he had pulled off that trade for "his guy" Cassell instead of being stuck with Kyle Orton. Anyway, that was a long time ago and the idea is that he's grown since then.

Like I said, I'm not a Josh fan, but it's not a very hard sell.

[King Bootz]

I'm not a Josh McDaniels fan but I get it. He's run one of the best offenses in New England for years. Yes, I get that people love to discredit anyone that plays with Brady for anything ever, but it's not his fault he got the GOAT and he sure as hell made the most of it. (Though I could argue Brady's numbers with Arians for 13 years would've been insane)

I think what turned it back on for people was watching him take a QB most thought was rather meh and have him lead the #6 ranked offense his first year. A little evidence that it's wasn't all Tom. Yes, his time in Denver was an absolute wreck. He came in too hot and tried to do too much and fell on his face. Though who knows what it could've looked like if he had pulled off that trade for "his guy" Cassell instead of being stuck with Kyle Orton. Anyway, that was a long time ago and the idea is that he's grown since then.

Like I said, I'm not a Josh fan, but it's not a very hard sell.

That solidifies the argument of Great OC/DC=/=Great HC.

[Doctor]

While that is true, some would say two years and one bad whiff when you were 32 years old should not be the entirety of which your HC chops are forever judged.

[King Bootz]

While that is true, some would say two years and one bad whiff when you were 32 years old should not be the entirety of which your HC chops are forever judged.

That experience plus the experience of burning another team at the 11th hour should though. To put it simply, McDaniels has been thus far unprofessional in 2 HC opportunities. How many chances is he going to keep getting?

[Snake]

This is probably the last one, assuming it goes poorly.

[Buc2]

While that is true, some would say two years and one bad whiff when you were 32 years old should not be the entirety of which your HC chops are forever judged.

Yep. Same thing many of us have said about Raheem Morris. Dude was brought into a nearly impossible situation as a first-time HC and, to the surprise of no one, he failed. Most anyone they hired probably would have failed as well. Raheem deserves a 2nd chance now that he's more seasoned. Just as McDaniels did. I still think it will happen for Morris eventually.

[King Bootz]

While that is true, some would say two years and one bad whiff when you were 32 years old should not be the entirety of which your HC chops are forever judged.

Yep. Same thing many of us have said about Raheem Morris. Dude was brought into a nearly impossible situation as a first-time HC and, to the surprise of no one, he failed. Most anyone they hired probably would have failed as well. Raheem deserves a 2nd chance now that he's more seasoned. Just as McDaniels did. I still think it will happen for Morris eventually.

What possible comparisons could be drawn between Raheem Morris' and Josh McDaniels' 1st coaching stints beyond being young?? Their situations honestly couldn't have been more polar opposites.

[Doctor]

Raheem also made damaging franchise moves chasing "his QB'.

[Crocaneers]

@Dread .. You had a great premise in the OP .. can you update the teams?

Thanks in advance.

[King Bootz]

Raheem also made damaging franchise moves chasing "his QB'.

Remember that thing you just said about not being "remotely sincere"? Pot.....Kettle....

[kaimaru]

Interesting article on the coaching hires.

Lovie Smith | Houston Texans | Grade: F
Mike McDaniel | Miami Dolphins | Grade: D-
Dennis Allen | New Orleans Saints | Grade: D
Matt Eberflus | Chicago Bears | Grade: D+
Nathaniel Hackett | Denver Broncos | Grade: C-
Kevin O’Connell | Minnesota Vikings | Grade: C
Doug Pederson | Philadelphia Eagles | Grade: C+
Brian Daboll | New York Giants | Grade: B
Josh McDaniels | Las Vegas Raiders | Grade: A

Interesting grades on the coaches. Doesn't seem like they like the hires with the exception of Josh McDaniels.

Oof, Watlerfootball is brutal with these grades.

Texans hire HC Lovie Smith: F Grade
Dolphins hire HC Mike McDaniel: F Grade
Saints hire HC Dennis Allen: F Grade
Bears hire HC Matt Eberflus: F Grade
Jaguars hire HC Doug Pederson: D Grade
Broncos hire HC Nathaniel Hackett: D/A Grade
Raiders hire HC Josh McDaniels: C+ Grade
Giants hire HC Brian Daboll: A- Grade

https://walterfootball.com/coachfirehire.php

[MJW]

Interesting article on the coaching hires.

Lovie Smith | Houston Texans | Grade: F
Mike McDaniel | Miami Dolphins | Grade: D-
Dennis Allen | New Orleans Saints | Grade: D
Matt Eberflus | Chicago Bears | Grade: D+
Nathaniel Hackett | Denver Broncos | Grade: C-
Kevin O’Connell | Minnesota Vikings | Grade: C
Doug Pederson | Philadelphia Eagles | Grade: C+
Brian Daboll | New York Giants | Grade: B
Josh McDaniels | Las Vegas Raiders | Grade: A

Interesting grades on the coaches. Doesn't seem like they like the hires with the exception of Josh McDaniels.

Oof, Watlerfootball is brutal with these grades.

Texans hire HC Lovie Smith: F Grade
Dolphins hire HC Mike McDaniel: F Grade
Saints hire HC Dennis Allen: F Grade
Bears hire HC Matt Eberflus: F Grade
Jaguars hire HC Doug Pederson: D Grade
Broncos hire HC Nathaniel Hackett: D/A Grade
Raiders hire HC Josh McDaniels: C+ Grade
Giants hire HC Brian Daboll: A- Grade

https://walterfootball.com/coachfirehire.php

Here are some grades from 2017's cycle:

https://www.sbnation.com/2017/1/12/1422 ... nce-joseph

Vance Joseph - B+
Sean McDermott - A-
Sean McVay - C
Anthony Lynn - B

Here are some grades from 2019:

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/1/10/ ... rades-2019

Kliff Kingsbury - C+
Freddie Kitchens - A-
Vic Fangio - B
Matt LaFleur - C+
Bruce Arians - B+
Adam Gase - D
Zack Taylor - C+
Brian Flores - C-

One more, here's 2015:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2015/01/11/nfl-c ... sis-grades

Gary Kubiak - B
John Fox - A-
Jim Tomsula - D+
Jack Del Rio - B-
Todd Bowles - A
Rex Ryan - B

This stuff is just for entertainment purposes only.

[kaimaru]

Oh, I was just amused how WFB just trashed all of the hires other than Daboll. Hackett was a D unless he trades for Rodgers. lol