Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Snake
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Snake »

He forgot his password or something. Same guy.
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Central_Buc
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Central_Buc »

Nobody wrote: Fri Apr 28, 2023 6:38 pm Here is the thing about adding weight. Simply adding more (even if it doesn’t impact your explosivitey indices) doesn’t always translate to better. You can add weight that (a) actually decreases your play leverage as your power to weight ratio suffers and/or (b) increases your opponent’s functional target area. Sometimes these two are even correlated (and the arrow can go either/both ways).

One of Kancey’s primary tools is (i) his small target area, (ii) compounded by his quickness and current leverage profile, and (iii) his extremely advanced hand usage (he wins a lot via first contact and/or clearing his pads against misplaced strikes that need a reset). More weight/size could negatively impact one or two of those.

So I don’t know that Kancey needs to get bigger (given his play profile) and I can just as easily see extra size working against him (even if he retains his explosiveness).

EDIT - The above is also a case being made that Kancey is closer to maxing out (lower ceiling) than one might like. His game absolutely relies in key ways on his present leverage and size profile.
That what I was getting at. Maybe they know a way to have him gain without losing explosivness and acceleration. I think he's gonna have to add some weight (at least the right amount) so that he doesn't get completely owned.
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Doctor
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Y'all overlooking the most important thing, we were surprised.
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Babeinbucland
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Babeinbucland »

acmillis wrote: Fri Apr 28, 2023 9:18 am You know who his measurements are literally identical to?!?!?


Sapp...so let's hold our horses on grading this kid for a couple of years.
And basically the same speed too- I think a lot of people either forget how fast Sapp was (especially (!) for his size) or they just never knew to begin with.
Last edited by Babeinbucland on Sat Apr 29, 2023 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Babeinbucland »

_MB_ wrote: Fri Apr 28, 2023 1:20 pm It's BPA at a position of need. That's how you do it.
Nuance like that is not the strong suit of many on this board lol
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MJW
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Doctor wrote: Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:59 pm Y'all overlooking the most important thing, we were surprised.
He wasn't even on my radar, because Bowles had never targeted a guy like that before - 6'1 280 - unless you squint at a few backup types. If this had been 1996-2008, I'd have been standing on the table for him.

I give Licht credit for targeting a unique and talented player, and I give Bowles credit for seeing a guy like that and figuring out how to use him.

FWIW, I was extremely impressed with him when I watched him. He reminded me a ton of guys like Sapp, Donald, etc. Just a human knife.

(And hey, if Bowles can't make him work, what an amazing 3-Tech if our next coach runs a 4-3!)
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Snake »

Find a woman who talks about you the same way these guys talk about Kancey lol

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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by 13F11B »

Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 8:18 am Find a woman who talks about you the same way these guys talk about Kancey lol

Looking good. Field time will tell. If he is what people say the interior of our DL will kill QBs. Perhaps we won't need to DIE by the Blitz.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Snake »

Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Nobody »

Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:46 pm Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
Yup. That’s more of less what I tried to convey in my brief excerpting of his traits/skillset.

The other thing is, don’t sleep on his advanced work with his hands. Its not just the small target area and the suddenness that offsets the length handicaps he’ll be dealing with. It’s his ability to be quick, accurate, violent, and diverse with his hand usage along with the above. You’ll see a lot of forced misses by him via an array of slaps/swipes/chops and a super quick arm over.

And like I said, a diverse rush suite/hand usage + a consistently mixed up rush plan keeps guys off balance. Length can be turned into a disadvantage if striking air or missing the numbers or being swatted takes you off balance or compromises your base.
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Babeinbucland
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Babeinbucland »

Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:46 pm Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
Can you show me where coaches look for a huge ass? I never knew that was part of the evaluation process for NFL players
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Nobody »

Babeinbucland wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:24 pm
Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:46 pm Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
Can you show me where coaches look for a huge ass? I never knew that was part of the evaluation process for NFL players
Posterior chain = linear explosiveness. Vert, broad jump et al.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by MJW »

Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:46 pm Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
Short arms are less of a problem when the linemen can't get HIS arms on you because you're too quick and slippery.
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Barnzy
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Barnzy »

MJW wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:37 pm
Snake wrote: Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:46 pm Went down the rabbit hole of rabbit holes last night.

From everything I’m seeing, the only thing that would keep him from being a successful NFL player is very short arms.

He has a huge ass, he’s hyper explosive, a slight guy for his position which just makes it harder to get hands on him. Ability to generate force from awkward angles, never out of the fight. I think that’s an underrated aspect of line play. And one reason Tristan Wirfs is so good. He doesn’t need a perfect platform like others might. Kinesthetic sense, and just straight up athleticism. When you pair ability to do awkward things with his explosion…that’s big.

So I’m very excited, but the short arms man…
Short arms are less of a problem when the linemen can't get HIS arms on you because you're too quick and slippery.
Agree. But we're not just talking about short arms but historically short arms. 30 inches. 2 inches smaller than "undersized" Donald.

I'm guessing if he had 32-33 inch arms he would've pushed being a top 5 pick with his production and testing. So am hoping it doesn't limit him. I'm not worried about his height or weight. At all. Just arms.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Doctor »

Thats a bit of a reach....
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Barnzy »

Got the chance to watch a bit more of him. Where I noticed the arm length the most was when we he would beat his matchup and then be on pursuit to the QB. Even when blowing by a guard they're still going to get a slight nudge on you to knock you slightly off balance and off course.

You won't be perfectly aligned to the QB and will often be reaching out sideways to take down the QB. Kancey simply doesn't have the arm length to pull off those off balance sacks. He needs to be right in the QB's lap.

I have no doubt he will force a lot of pressures and force QB's to move to their left or right to avoid his rush. But I have questions about his ability converting pressures to sacks at the NFL level.

I think I would've taken Smith-Njigba. I think the floor is so much higher with no real risk in that pick.

So the floor is much lower with potential outcome but the ceiling higher? I'm not so sure. We likely overlooked the best WR in this draft and potential pro bowl WR. Does a penetrating DT have a higher upside than a star WR in 2023? Time will tell.

Kancey would need to be the best of the best to match up to the likely WR production. I have as much long term question marks on our WR room as I do our DL room, going forward.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Barnzy wrote: Sat May 06, 2023 10:17 pm Got the chance to watch a bit more of him. Where I noticed the arm length the most was when we he would beat his matchup and then be on pursuit to the QB. Even when blowing by a guard they're still going to get a slight nudge on you to knock you slightly off balance and off course.

You won't be perfectly aligned to the QB and will often be reaching out sideways to take down the QB. Kancey simply doesn't have the arm length to pull off those off balance sacks. He needs to be right in the QB's lap.

I have no doubt he will force a lot of pressures and force QB's to move to their left or right to avoid his rush. But I have questions about his ability converting pressures to sacks at the NFL level.

I think I would've taken Smith-Njigba. I think the floor is so much higher with no real risk in that pick.

So the floor is much lower with potential outcome but the ceiling higher? I'm not so sure. We likely overlooked the best WR in this draft and potential pro bowl WR. Does a penetrating DT have a higher upside than a star WR in 2023? Time will tell.

Kancey would need to be the best of the best to match up to the likely WR production. I have as much long term question marks on our WR room as I do our DL room, going forward.
Well if he can't get to the QB but forces him back another 10 or so yards, then he'll run right into JTS. It'll look like its all according to plan.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Greg Gaines has short arms too.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by IchabodCrane84 »

Dude just pulled in the Defensive Rookie of the Month award.

Bright spot in a dim year.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Weekly grades after rookie season.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Sdbucs »

Snake wrote: Tue Jan 09, 2024 1:30 pm Weekly grades after rookie season.
Aaron Donald rookie season for comparison
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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A little different…
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Bootz »

A little?!? Donald is a HOF for a reason.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Buc2 »

I'm sure @Snake said that tongue-in-cheek. :lol:
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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baby sapp
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Cheb »

Grahamburn wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 5:35 pm
Whatever predraft concerns I had about Kancey fitting into our base defense have proven to be overblown -- he's so goddamn fast with his hands and feet that it doesn't matter.

Kancey has delivered on his promised potential and then some. Even if he doesn't light up the stat sheet, he's actively altering offenses in a big way, redirecting backfield flow and making his teammates' jobs easier. And Calijah was playing against a talented Eagles front in that video, mind you, which shouldn't be overlooked.

Jason Licht has done it again. 10/10, full marks, no notes on this one my dude.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Grahamburn wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 5:35 pm
Those last 2 clips are freaky good. He crossed the face of the OL before they could get started. That’s insane
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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He has 4 sacks & 10 TFL in 14 games. He makes splash plays. He's a lot stronger than his listed size might indicate. I say listed because he looks and plays bigger than he is.

CK has been a bright spot on this defense and will continue to wreck havoc for years to come.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Grahamburn wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 5:35 pm
Also shows Anthony Nelson got robbed of a sack.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Rocker »

Bootz wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 10:34 pm He has 4 sacks & 10 TFL in 14 games. He makes splash plays. He's a lot stronger than his listed size might indicate. I say listed because he looks and plays bigger than he is.

CK has been a bright spot on this defense and will continue to wreck havoc for years to come.
Still “looks” a bit light in the pants to me; but he has an absolute freak of nature ability to go speed to power and put the opposition on skates.

I think we got a good one.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Jonny »

]
There was a stretch of games near the end of the season where Kancey's impact felt invisible similar to how we are used to vanishing acts from JTS. Some teams have managed to use his quickness against him to wash him out of plays. But it is amazing to see that against a probowl and all-pro O-line, he put together a great game and is feeling amazing about it based on his body language post game. I hope he gets more prime time opportunities with the nation watching him where he can put on a show and let the world know he was the better rookie DT compared to Jalen Carter who gets press for simply existing at this point, sort of like when Obama won the Nobel peace prize.
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

Post by Jonny »

DI CALIJAH KANCEY, TAMPA BAY BUCCANEERS: ROOKIE QB PRESSURES
Kancey’s six quarterback pressures against the Eagles are the most for a rookie interior defender in a playoff game in the PFF era.

Before Kancey's record-breaking effort, the Texans' J.J. Watt (2011) was the only rookie interior defender to generate five quarterback pressures in a playoff game in the PFF era. Kancey finished the wild-card round with five hurries and a sack.
Per PFF. Does anyone have Jalen Carter's PFF grades for this season in general?
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Re: Welcome Calijah Kancey

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Redrum wrote: Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:49 pm
I noticed a lot of double teaming on Vea in those highlights leaving Kancey with one-on-one's. OLs are going to start having to pick their poison. Double team Vea and Kancey will wreck their plans. Start doubling Kancey and Vea will wreck their plans. It's looking like some fun times coming for this defense as long as these 2 guys stay healthy.
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