Welcome Baker Mayfield

[acmillis]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

[Grahamburn]

Best case is for the best player to show out, win the job, and play the best for us. Which results in an offense that puts up more points than our defense allows.

Sure. Broken down in its simplest terms.

[Grahamburn]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

He had the Browns in the playoffs in his 3rd year. The Browns!

[Cheb]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

You're never going to believe this, but there's this guy on the Seahawks named Geno Smith who in his tenth season led the league in completion percentage, had his first winning season and playoff game, and rightly won Comeback Player of the Year. This happened just a few months ago. And his position coach who helped facilitate all that is now our offensive coordinator.

Crazy, right?

[Doctor]

The Madden generation is obsessed with these heroes, they pretend narratives like Brad Johnson, Rich Gannon, Jake Delhomme, Kurt Warner, Steve Young, Trent Dilfer, etc aren't real.

[Deja Entendu]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

Drew Brees comes to mind.

[acmillis]

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

You're never going to believe this, but there's this guy on the Seahawks named Geno Smith who in his tenth season led the league in completion percentage, had his first winning season and playoff game, and rightly won Comeback Player of the Year. This happened just a few months ago. And his position coach who helped facilitate all that is now our offensive coordinator.

Crazy, right?

You're 100% correct. An OP mentioned Drew Brees. So, we're talking 1-2 QBs per generation that after 5+ years in the league, turn out to be HOF (Brees) or have 1 good season (thus far).

Consider me whelmed.

[Deja Entendu]

It’s not like he was a total bum/bust in Cleveland. A lot of QBs have resurrected their careers after rocky starts. Some to HOF level (extremely rare obv), but many who had respectable careers with playoff and SB wins

There’s a pretty big space between: turned to a HOF and only had one good season after 5 years in the league.

[Four Verticals]

When's the last time a QB took until his 6th year in the league to "get it" and be a "hero?"

Drew Brees comes to mind.

Brees was 5th in OPOY voting in year 4, got injured at the end of the following year. He was probably just as good year 4 with the Chargers as he was after he was with the the Saints.

[Grahamburn]

The Madden generation is obsessed with these heroes, they pretend narratives like Brad Johnson, Rich Gannon, Jake Delhomme, Kurt Warner, Steve Young, Trent Dilfer, etc aren't real.

To be fair the "win with defense, running game, and game manager QB" narrative in the NFL has been pretty much put out to pasture.

That being said I'm excited about this experiment and hope we have a difficult, or easy? I guess, decision to make at QB after the year.

[Doctor]

Why is Brees the bar? Don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I'd be more than grateful for Brad Johnson.
No one in the NFC scares me. No one. If we can get the offense back to where we aren't top 5 at gassing our defense, it can get back to being the gravediggers. Get the feedback loop working back in our favor. That's enough to beat the likes of Hurts, Dak, and Purdy. And we know what Bowles can do against Reid.

Is it as likely to happen as our 2020 run? No. Probably nothing else ever will. But it's far from unbelievable and would hardly be as crazy as Nick Foles.
And honestly, pound for pound, we're still likely in a better situation than we've been during any of the Freeman or Winston years.

[Sdbucs]

Why is Brees the bar? Don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I'd be more than grateful for Brad Johnson.
No one in the NFC scares me. No one. If we can get the offense back to where we aren't top 5 at gassing our defense, it can get back to being the gravediggers. Get the feedback loop working back in our favor. That's enough to beat the likes of Hurts, Dak, and Purdy. And we know what Bowles can do against Reid.

Is it as likely to happen as our 2020 run? No. Probably nothing else ever will. But it's far from unbelievable and would hardly be as crazy as Nick Foles.
And honestly, pound for pound, we're still likely in a better situation than we've been during any of the Freeman or Winston years.

Bucs are +700 to win the division. I honestly take that

[real bucs fan]

Ya there seems to be this false narrative that Baker was a total bust in Cleveland.

Year 1: Rookie of the year
Year 2: admittedly disappointing, but on a dysfunctional team.
Year 3: Good season, took Browns to the playoffs and beat the Steelers.
Year 4: injury plagued.
Year 5: admittedly disappointing, but on a dysfunctional team after the Browns went full retard for Deshaun Watson.

So basically he’s had 2 good years, 2 bad years with dysfunctional teams, and an injury plagued season.

In conclusion, when healthy and on a non dysfunctional team, seems a pretty good bet that Baker can play good football.

[Doctor]

With like 6 OCs in that time.

[MJW]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

It's my fault for acknowledging you.

[Snake]

Baker throws 60+ mph. Which is plenty of arm strength and puts him among the league’s best (arms).

It’s really just everything else.

[Doctor]

The "he needs more time" trope is just another form of hero-worshiping from the rookie savior crowd. It disregards all the other variables in the sport and dumbs it down to "if he was a hero he'd be a hero by now". Which is the precursor to "you need a hero to win in this league" that is followed by "I'm not saying we should try to lose but...."

It's my fault for acknowledging you.

You brought this upon yourself

[Doctor]

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... cker-room/


https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... -mayfield/

So apparently the brilliant Ravens wanted Baker as their fall back option. Either Baker seems to believe it'll work itself out in Baltimore or he like our weapons and situation better regardless.

[MJW]

Why is Brees the bar? Don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I'd be more than grateful for Brad Johnson.
No one in the NFC scares me. No one. If we can get the offense back to where we aren't top 5 at gassing our defense, it can get back to being the gravediggers. Get the feedback loop working back in our favor. That's enough to beat the likes of Hurts, Dak, and Purdy. And we know what Bowles can do against Reid.

Is it as likely to happen as our 2020 run? No. Probably nothing else ever will. But it's far from unbelievable and would hardly be as crazy as Nick Foles.
And honestly, pound for pound, we're still likely in a better situation than we've been during any of the Freeman or Winston years.

It's much more believable this is one of the worst teams in the league than it is Baker Mayfield accomplishes more with a worse roster than Tom Brady could with a better one.

But I am looking forward to the "Better than the Freeman era!" T-shirts and banners.

[real bucs fan]

Why is Brees the bar? Don't get me wrong, it would be great, but I'd be more than grateful for Brad Johnson.
No one in the NFC scares me. No one. If we can get the offense back to where we aren't top 5 at gassing our defense, it can get back to being the gravediggers. Get the feedback loop working back in our favor. That's enough to beat the likes of Hurts, Dak, and Purdy. And we know what Bowles can do against Reid.

Is it as likely to happen as our 2020 run? No. Probably nothing else ever will. But it's far from unbelievable and would hardly be as crazy as Nick Foles.
And honestly, pound for pound, we're still likely in a better situation than we've been during any of the Freeman or Winston years.

It's much more believable this is one of the worst teams in the league than it is Baker Mayfield accomplishes more with a worse roster than Tom Brady could with a better one.

But I am looking forward to the "Better than the Freeman era!" T-shirts and banners.

Last year failed because of OL play and Arians retiring. Full stop.

No one is expecting Baker to outperform Brady in his first two years here where he was a borderline MVP and won us a Super Bowl.

But Baker can 100% lead a better offence under Canales than what we saw last year under Leftwich.

[MJW]

It's much more believable this is one of the worst teams in the league than it is Baker Mayfield accomplishes more with a worse roster than Tom Brady could with a better one.

But I am looking forward to the "Better than the Freeman era!" T-shirts and banners.

Last year failed because of OL play and Arians retiring. Full stop.

No one is expecting Baker to outperform Brady in his first two years here where he was a borderline MVP and won us a Super Bowl.

But Baker can 100% lead a better offence under Canales than what we saw last year under Leftwich.

Got it. Nothing to do with our awful head coach, or our poorly constructed roster. It was all the OC, and now that we've replaced him with some guy, look out 49ers and Eagles.

[Naismith]

I'm not sure what the best case scenario is for this team if it somehow plays better than last year. Look better in a playoff loss?

[Doctor]

How is it a poorly constructed roster?? Virtually everyone has been here during our 3 year playoff streak.

[MJW]

How is it a poorly constructed roster?? Virtually everyone has been here during our 3 year playoff streak.

We had no depth, especially on the lines. A fact that was exposed.

We have less now than we did then.

Licht chose to add DBs and WRs. That was a huge part of the problem. We could have had Cappa all season for about what we wasted on Gage, instead of panicing and wasting a pick on Goedeke.

Also, just because you choose to ignore the defections doesn't mean they cease to matter. Rojo, AB, Gronk, Howard, Cappa, Suh, McClendon, JPP, etc. We lost a TON Of guys from 2020-2022, but the casuals were too busy reading the ESPN stories about how we returned "everybody."

[real bucs fan]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

[MJW]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

Does Canales have a "system" we're sure of? He wasn't the Seahawks OC. They passed him over for that job. Twice. We have the systems of people he worked for, and some extrapolations based on press conferences.

[Doctor]

If certainty is what you are after maybe sports isn't for you

[MJW]

If certainty is what you are after maybe sports isn't for you

That sounds like "yeah you're right" translated through asshole dot com.

[mdb1958]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

Does Canales have a "system" we're sure of? He wasn't the Seahawks OC. They passed him over for that job. Twice. We have the systems of people he worked for, and some extrapolations based on press conferences.

Wait and see is your answer. By the way in three years with Brady did he ever not live in the pocket?

[GreatTimes]

I don't care what system you have, if you don't have players who can fulfill their assignments, that system is going to fail.

[real bucs fan]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

Does Canales have a "system" we're sure of? He wasn't the Seahawks OC. They passed him over for that job. Twice. We have the systems of people he worked for, and some extrapolations based on press conferences.

There was a recent quote by Tristan Wirfs where he said Canales system is OL friendly

[Doctor]

Doesn't matter. Anything positive from our players is BS and "what are they suppose to say".

Meanwhile anything negative our local Sherlock Holmes extrapolated are hard facts.

[Grahamburn]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

Didn't Gage have an early hamstring injury? I think that really sapped him of his quickness, which is what makes him dangerous. Anyway, sometimes it takes guys a minute to get acclimated to a new place. I admire him for understanding that he didn't perform to his contract and therefore agreed to restructure it to help the team. That says a lot about the man.

[real bucs fan]

Gage was a huge bust. Probably the most disappointing player of last season along with Donovan Smith. Smith sucking… Marpet retiring… Jensen injured… the OL was definitely the Achilles heal, and the whole offence suffered. Arians system is very demanding of the OL and we simply didn’t have the horses. Canales system is OL friendly so that should help.

Didn't Gage have an early hamstring injury? I think that really sapped him of his quickness, which is what makes him dangerous. Anyway, sometimes it takes guys a minute to get acclimated to a new place. I admire him for understanding that he didn't perform to his contract and therefore agreed to restructure it to help the team. That says a lot about the man.

Hoping that’s the case.

[Doctor]

He did and re-aggravated it trying to get back early.