The Official Jameis Winston Thread

[Dread]

Jameis Winston was the Bucs #1 overall pick and franchise QB for 5 seasons. So fans of the Bucs aren't going to treat him like he's Jared Goff, Wentz or any other QB. Fans are emotionally invested in Jameis because the franchise was committed and all-in on him for 5 years.

It's naive to think Bucs fans will treat Jameis with the same indifference they would any other QB due to recent history.

As far as how the Saints can score 38 last week, that's easy. Run the ball incredibly well so your offense is in 2nd and short all game and have your defense create short fields for your offense.

In that game vs the Packers the Saints has two good offensive drives were most of the work was done rushing the ball or checking down (both drives were 15 plays iirc). The rest of the game was just the defense setting them up.

Yesterday the Saints offense kept falling behind the chains due to penalties and sacks. The Panthers loaded up on Kamara and run game and for the Saints lacked the will and/or firepower to make them pay with chunk plays in the passing game.

That’s my point. People know the arguments they are making are biased, subjective, and fabricated in nature. Why get pissy when you get called out? Better yet, why pretend you’re making a competent argument. No one is. 1 person had the balls to admit they weren’t being objective and that her arguments lacked credibility or truth. 1. Everyone would better serve themselves to do the same. Quit acting as if you’re making knowledgeable points.

As far as the Packers v Saints game, not exactly how it played out. You’ve picked an arbitrary number that fit your argument as to what conservative or “check down” is. For that game I believe you said 20 yards. The Panthers game you said 10. Does it surprise you that no named WRs struggle to get open down the field? It’s a as if every attempt has been a check down. The Saints had quite a few passes past 20 yards last week. Yesterday as well.

Nothing is subjective or fabricated when I state the fact the Saints passing game has been conservative through 2 games. The less than 100yds passing after 3 quarters in week 1 and less than 100yds total yesterday are simply undeniable.

How do explain losing by atleast 10pts for most of the game yet still not have 100yds passing for the game?

They were able to get away with that in week 1 so it' understandable not to risk throws downfield when you don't need to.

What about yesterday? Why such limited attempts or completions when the ball travels beyond 10yds in the air?

If you don't want to call that conservative play-calling, what do you call it?

[Dread]

Saying Jameis Winston had a shitty game yesterday isn't a lie, nor is saying that he has a history of shit play alternating with spectacular.

We've all had front row seats to the wild rollercoaster that has been Jameis's career. None of us should be surprised by it. The only surprising thing to me is that anyone can say with a straight face that the man is either consistently good or consistently bad. The only thing Jameis is consistently is inconsistent.

As always, we will see how the season plays out to see if he's found any semblance of even-keeled play, but if the first two games are any indication, Bipolar Jameis seems to be in midseason form.

I don't think Jameis was all that different from week 1 to week 2. People get too enamoured with the box score and draw they opinions from it.

Winston's stats in terms of completions, attempts, average yds per attempt, and passing yards were pretty similar throughout both games.

The difference in the two games is that in week 1 vs Green Bay the Saints ran the ball great, 140yds in the first half and like 180 for the game. They also didn't hurt themselves with penalties and sacks so their offense could play in favorable down and distance all game.

Yesterday they played sloppy and couldn't run the ball. Jameis didn't have the RZ opps like had in week 1 so he didn't have the chance to pad the passing TD stats. But other than that he was the same QB pretty much.

Jamies is just an average QB at best, and like every other average QB he isn't good enough to carry an offense, especially when that offense lacks playmakers at WR and TE like the Saints do.

There is just no explosive element in the Saints passing game other than hoping Kamara can make some magic happen.

[Dread]

This is impressive

[King Bootz]

That’s my point. People know the arguments they are making are biased, subjective, and fabricated in nature. Why get pissy when you get called out? Better yet, why pretend you’re making a competent argument. No one is. 1 person had the balls to admit they weren’t being objective and that her arguments lacked credibility or truth. 1. Everyone would better serve themselves to do the same. Quit acting as if you’re making knowledgeable points.

As far as the Packers v Saints game, not exactly how it played out. You’ve picked an arbitrary number that fit your argument as to what conservative or “check down” is. For that game I believe you said 20 yards. The Panthers game you said 10. Does it surprise you that no named WRs struggle to get open down the field? It’s a as if every attempt has been a check down. The Saints had quite a few passes past 20 yards last week. Yesterday as well.

Nothing is subjective or fabricated when I state the fact the Saints passing game has been conservative through 2 games. The less than 100yds passing after 3 quarters in week 1 and less than 100yds total yesterday are simply undeniable.

How do explain losing by atleast 10pts for most of the game yet still not have 100yds passing for the game?

They were able to get away with that in week 1 so it' understandable not to risk throws downfield when you don't need to.

What about yesterday? Why such limited attempts or completions when the ball travels beyond 10yds in the air?

If you don't want to call that conservative play-calling, what do you call it?

It's called taking what the defense gives you. You're only adding to the bias. If Winston were to take his 1st reads and force passes down the field, narrative be "AHAY! SEE, HE CAN'T HELP HIMSELF".

I've watched both games. Sean Payton isn't calling checkdown plays like you're saying he is. Winston has actually been going through his reads, guys simply are not getting open down the field. The commentators pointed this out several times. He's taking the checkdowns.

That's not conservative play calling. You can't simply look at the result and say "short passes= conservative". I think you know that, but because of the bias at play, you're simply choosing a different argument now.

So which would you rather have? A QB who throws passes down the field when they are well covered or a QB who checks the ball down when the passes aren't there. Seems like whatever happens you're going to create an argument against it.

[King Bootz]

Saying Jameis Winston had a shitty game yesterday isn't a lie, nor is saying that he has a history of shit play alternating with spectacular.

We've all had front row seats to the wild rollercoaster that has been Jameis's career. None of us should be surprised by it. The only surprising thing to me is that anyone can say with a straight face that the man is either consistently good or consistently bad. The only thing Jameis is consistently is inconsistent.

As always, we will see how the season plays out to see if he's found any semblance of even-keeled play, but if the first two games are any indication, Bipolar Jameis seems to be in midseason form.

Winston's stats in terms of completions, attempts, average yds per attempt, and passing yards were pretty similar throughout both games.

More lies. Apparently completing 70% is the same as completing 50% of your passes. Man just admit that you're biased here and move on. The lies are getting pretty embarrassing.

[King Bootz]

This is impressive

If it's the worst of his career, how is it "same as usual" as some are saying?

[13F11B]

This is impressive

If it's the worst of his career, how is it "same as usual" as some are saying?

I can only speak for myself but let me give this a try. I sense, given your posts, I will have to make this as simple as I can which is not a strength of mine.

For me, the issue is consistency. Winston has not had that over his career. He has absolutely astounding games. He has absolutely stinker games. The other issue I had with Winston is that he also makes critical mistakes late in games when there is still a chance at winning.

In simple terms: It is usual for Jameis to be inconsistent.

[Max]

Inexplicable that we don't treat our former 

face of the franchise
number one overall pick 
starting quarterback of five years 

now starting quarterback of a division rival

the same way as any other random QB. It's puzzling.

[King Bootz]

Guess Dread thought leaving this bit out would make him look better.

[King Bootz]

If it's the worst of his career, how is it "same as usual" as some are saying?

I can only speak for myself but let me give this a try. I sense, given your posts, I will have to make this as simple as I can which is not a strength of mine.

For me, the issue is consistency. Winston has not had that over his career. He has absolutely astounding games. He has absolutely stinker games. The other issue I had with Winston is that he also makes critical mistakes late in games when there is still a chance at winning.

In simple terms: It is usual for Jameis to be inconsistent.

We agree. Inconsistent. However, and maybe I need to make this simple for you since I know what Inconsistent means, Inconsistent is not the same as consistently bad, which is what some are trying to convey.

[King Bootz]

Inexplicable that we don't treat our former 

face of the franchise
number one overall pick 
starting quarterback of five years 

now starting quarterback of a division rival

the same way as any other random QB. It's puzzling.

No that's not puzzling. What's puzzling is pretending to make credible, accurate arguments against Winston. Admit that you're viewing him with an implied biased and move on. Nothing wrong with admitting you're not making logical points against him.

[Max]

Isn't it interesting how bad O-Line play followed Jameis from Tampa to New Orleans, while our O-Line suddenly became a top-5 unit with Brady under center?

[CannonFire]

You don't remember Shaq Barrett showing up on Total Access on NFL network before the draft in 2020. He was asked who the bucs should pick with their first pick. He said "A quarterback." Still want to stand by that?

post the link lol

also kyle trask looked like shit in the preseason. Yall better hope brady stays healthy for the entire season lol

Barrett said it on March 12, 2020... 8 days before Brady. He even said that if the Bucs did bring in Brady, they should still draft a QB.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/20 ... se-player/

"When Barrett was asked what position he would draft if he were the Bucs general manager, he said a quarterback. The Bucs own the No. 14 overall pick.

“So for us ... like me, personally, I would think of a quarterback and then if we were to bring Tom, and if Tom was there to help him develop him a little bit,” Barrett said. “But I would draft a quarterback first and figure it out.”"

[King Bootz]

Isn't it interesting how bad O-Line play followed Jameis from Tampa to New Orleans, while our O-Line suddenly became a top-5 unit with Brady under center?

See? Bias. When you counter evidence without any of your own, you're showing bias and lacking credibility.

[BLT]

Have said for years that Jameis lack of pocket awareness, and holding on to the ball too long, always made his O line look bad.

[BLT]

Isn't it interesting how bad O-Line play followed Jameis from Tampa to New Orleans, while our O-Line suddenly became a top-5 unit with Brady under center?

See? Bias. When you counter evidence without any of your own, you're showing bias and lacking credibility.

You are embarrassing yourself badly.

[King Bootz]

See? Bias. When you counter evidence without any of your own, you're showing bias and lacking credibility.

You are embarrassing yourself badly.

Saying something doesn't make it true. Arguing against facts makes you look plain stupid. That in itself is embarrassing.

[CannonFire]

The only difference between Jay Cutler and Jameis Winston is skin color. Not that hard really.

[vivalaReagan]

Nothing is subjective or fabricated when I state the fact the Saints passing game has been conservative through 2 games. The less than 100yds passing after 3 quarters in week 1 and less than 100yds total yesterday are simply undeniable.

How do explain losing by atleast 10pts for most of the game yet still not have 100yds passing for the game?

They were able to get away with that in week 1 so it' understandable not to risk throws downfield when you don't need to.

What about yesterday? Why such limited attempts or completions when the ball travels beyond 10yds in the air?

If you don't want to call that conservative play-calling, what do you call it?

It's called taking what the defense gives you. You're only adding to the bias. If Winston were to take his 1st reads and force passes down the field, narrative be "AHAY! SEE, HE CAN'T HELP HIMSELF".

I've watched both games. Sean Payton isn't calling checkdown plays like you're saying he is. Winston has actually been going through his reads, guys simply are not getting open down the field. The commentators pointed this out several times. He's taking the checkdowns.

That's not conservative play calling. You can't simply look at the result and say "short passes= conservative". I think you know that, but because of the bias at play, you're simply choosing a different argument now.

So which would you rather have? A QB who throws passes down the field when they are well covered or a QB who checks the ball down when the passes aren't there. Seems like whatever happens you're going to create an argument against it.

“It's called taking what the defense gives you”? lol tell us you don’t know what you’re watching without telling us you don’t know what you’re watching.

jameis is averaging less than 130 passing yards per game, so i guess the panthers and packers must have historically great defenses.

jameis is also averaging a mere 21 pass attempts per game, and only attempted 22 passes yesterday when the ‘aints were scoreless through three quarters and couldn’t run the ball at all. but that’s not conservative play calling, right? you must be seeing something payton isn’t, or is he biased and lying like everyone but you?

[King Bootz]

It's called taking what the defense gives you. You're only adding to the bias. If Winston were to take his 1st reads and force passes down the field, narrative be "AHAY! SEE, HE CAN'T HELP HIMSELF".

I've watched both games. Sean Payton isn't calling checkdown plays like you're saying he is. Winston has actually been going through his reads, guys simply are not getting open down the field. The commentators pointed this out several times. He's taking the checkdowns.

That's not conservative play calling. You can't simply look at the result and say "short passes= conservative". I think you know that, but because of the bias at play, you're simply choosing a different argument now.

So which would you rather have? A QB who throws passes down the field when they are well covered or a QB who checks the ball down when the passes aren't there. Seems like whatever happens you're going to create an argument against it.

“It's called taking what the defense gives you”? lol tell us you don’t know what you’re watching without telling us you don’t know what you’re watching.

jameis is averaging less than 130 passing yards per game, so i guess the panthers and packers must have historically great defenses.

jameis is also averaging a mere 21 pass attempts per game, and only attempted 22 passes yesterday when the ‘aints were scoreless through three quarters and couldn’t run the ball at all. but that’s not conservative play calling, right? you must be seeing something payton isn’t, or is he biased and lying like everyone but you?

Tell us you didn't watch the game without telling us you didn't watch the game.

New Orleans had 43 plays on offense compared to 73 for Carolina. New Orleans had just 21 minutes T.O.P. Winston had 29 drop backs. 22 were passed, 4 ended in sacks, 3 ended in rushes. He had 19 yards rushing, which lead the team. The Saints called 14 runs yesterday. 29 called passes, 14 called runs. Over 2 to 1 pass to run ratio.

Again tell me you didn't watch the game without telling me you didn't watch the game.

As I've said before, admit your bias. Stop hiding and cowering. You're embarrassing yourself. You really told us you don’t understand football.

[King Bootz]

post the link lol

also kyle trask looked like shit in the preseason. Yall better hope brady stays healthy for the entire season lol

Barrett said it on March 12, 2020... 8 days before Brady. He even said that if the Bucs did bring in Brady, they should still draft a QB.
https://www.tampabay.com/sports/bucs/20 ... se-player/

"When Barrett was asked what position he would draft if he were the Bucs general manager, he said a quarterback. The Bucs own the No. 14 overall pick.

“So for us ... like me, personally, I would think of a quarterback and then if we were to bring Tom, and if Tom was there to help him develop him a little bit,” Barrett said. “But I would draft a quarterback first and figure it out.”"

People here don't care about the truth. They like making up their own narratives.

[Dread]

This is impressive

If it's the worst of his career, how is it "same as usual" as some are saying?

His career has been pretty terrible to this point.

In yesterday's game Winston was 8/10 for around 80 yds late in the 3rd quarter before it became desperation mode down multiple scores in the 4th. That wasn't all that different from his statline in week 1 before throwing that 55yd TD to #11 late in the game already up 31-3.

So my point from both games is Jameis isn't attempting passes downfield, whether that is the play calling, receivers not getting open, or Jameis making the decision to throw short the end result is the same, which is the fact that the Saints passing offense has b2b games with less that 100yds through the first 3 quarters of the game.

[Max]

This should be renamed into the official 2021 dunk on Bootz thread.

[Rocker]

A reasonable fan would understand that with 300 Covid coaches, their would be some noticeable reduction in their play.

A reasonable fan would also expect a QB that’s been playing as long as Winston would be able to call protections.

[King Bootz]

A reasonable fan would understand that with 300 Covid coaches, their would be some noticeable reduction in their play.

A reasonable fan would also expect a QB that’s been playing as long as Winston would be able to call protections.

Fans here aren't even objective or truthful. You're expecting them to be rational? That's another example of irony, kiddo.

[King Bootz]

If it's the worst of his career, how is it "same as usual" as some are saying?

His career has been pretty terrible to this point.

In yesterday's game Winston was 8/10 for around 80 yds late in the 3rd quarter

Lie

before it became desperation mode down multiple scores in the 4th.

Wrong, they were already down multiple scores. Another lie.

That wasn't all that different from his statline in week 1 before throwing that 55yd TD to #11 late in the game already up 31-3.

Major lie. You're trying to convince people that there's no fundamental difference in having 4 TD passes, 0 INTs and completing 70% of your passes and having 0 TDs, 1 pick and being around 55% completion (at the time).

So my point from both games is Jameis isn't attempting passes downfield,

again,not true. Winston isn't COMPLETING passes down the field much through 2 weeks. The attempts are there. You'd know this if you truly watched both games.

whether that is the play calling, receivers not getting open, or Jameis making the decision to throw short the end result is the same, which is the fact that the Saints passing offense has b2b games with less that 100yds through the first 3 quarters of the game.

You were a major supporter of the "yards don't matter" argument a few years back. It's interesting to see you pull a 180 here and all of a sudden use yards as a condemnation.

[vivalaReagan]

“It's called taking what the defense gives you”? lol tell us you don’t know what you’re watching without telling us you don’t know what you’re watching.

jameis is averaging less than 130 passing yards per game, so i guess the panthers and packers must have historically great defenses.

jameis is also averaging a mere 21 pass attempts per game, and only attempted 22 passes yesterday when the ‘aints were scoreless through three quarters and couldn’t run the ball at all. but that’s not conservative play calling, right? you must be seeing something payton isn’t, or is he biased and lying like everyone but you?

Tell us you didn't watch the game without telling us you didn't watch the game.

New Orleans had 43 plays on offense compared to 73 for Carolina. New Orleans had just 21 minutes T.O.P. Winston had 29 drop backs. 22 were passed, 4 ended in sacks, 3 ended in rushes. He had 19 yards rushing, which lead the team. The Saints called 14 runs yesterday. 29 called passes, 14 called runs. Over 2 to 1 pass to run ratio.

Again tell me you didn't watch the game without telling me you didn't watch the game.

As I've said before, admit your bias. Stop hiding and cowering. You're embarrassing yourself. You really told us you don’t understand football.

so your defense of jameis is that the offense sucked?

the disparity in run vs. pass was skewed by the fourth quarter desperation offense, after being held scoreless for three quarters. but you knew this, didn’t you?

the reason for the low amount of plays and t.o.p. is the fact that the jameis-led offense had the following abysmal stats: 18% third down conversion rate, 0-2 on fourth down, six punts, 2 interceptions, 3.1 yards per pass average, and possibly most damming was the mere 5 offensive first downs.

read that again: a jameis winston led offense managed 1.25 first downs per quarter. “but but but he led the team in rushing!” lol. now that’s qb play worth defending; it’s a mystery why BA and licht let him go.

ah, it’s good to have you back, bootsie.

[King Bootz]

Tell us you didn't watch the game without telling us you didn't watch the game.

New Orleans had 43 plays on offense compared to 73 for Carolina. New Orleans had just 21 minutes T.O.P. Winston had 29 drop backs. 22 were passed, 4 ended in sacks, 3 ended in rushes. He had 19 yards rushing, which lead the team. The Saints called 14 runs yesterday. 29 called passes, 14 called runs. Over 2 to 1 pass to run ratio.

Again tell me you didn't watch the game without telling me you didn't watch the game.

As I've said before, admit your bias. Stop hiding and cowering. You're embarrassing yourself. You really told us you don’t understand football.

so your defense of jameis is that the offense sucked?

the reason for the low amount of plays and t.o.p. is the fact that the jameis-led offense had the following abysmal stats: 18% third down conversion rate, 0-2 on fourth down, six punts, 2 interceptions, 3.1 yards per pass average, and possibly most damming was the mere 5 offensive first downs.

read that again: a jameis winston led offense managed 1.25 first downs per quarter. “but but but he led the team in rushing!” lol. now that’s qb play worth defending; it’s a mystery why BA and licht let him go.

ah, it’s good to have you back, bootsie.

Again, continue to tell us you didn't watch the game and that you're biased.

Pre-snap penalties killed them yesterday on offense. He lead their run game with 19 yards. Remember that Bucs/Saints game last year in Tampa? Yea, that tends to happen when you can't run the ball. Did you blame Brady for that loss?

Read the article as well. It outlines what happened in yesterday's game.

I'm happy you're so open about your lack of integrity or knowledge on this subject. You're fighting against facts as hard as anyone I've seen here in a long time. Keep it up. You newbies have no shame.

[vivalaReagan]

so your defense of jameis is that the offense sucked?

the reason for the low amount of plays and t.o.p. is the fact that the jameis-led offense had the following abysmal stats: 18% third down conversion rate, 0-2 on fourth down, six punts, 2 interceptions, 3.1 yards per pass average, and possibly most damming was the mere 5 offensive first downs.

read that again: a jameis winston led offense managed 1.25 first downs per quarter. “but but but he led the team in rushing!” lol. now that’s qb play worth defending; it’s a mystery why BA and licht let him go.

ah, it’s good to have you back, bootsie.

Again, continue to tell us you didn't watch the game and that you're biased.

Pre-snap penalties killed them yesterday on offense. He lead their run game with 19 yards. Remember that Bucs/Saints game last year in Tampa? Yea, that tends to happen when you can't run the ball. Did you blame Brady for that loss?

Read the article as well. It outlines what happened in yesterday's game.

I'm happy you're so open about your lack of integrity or knowledge on this subject. You're fighting against facts as hard as anyone I've seen here in a long time. Keep it up. You newbies have no shame.

He LeD tHeIr RuN gAmE, dAmMiT! lololol

tell us you’ve run out of argument without telling us you’ve run out of argument.

[King Bootz]

Again, continue to tell us you didn't watch the game and that you're biased.

Pre-snap penalties killed them yesterday on offense. He lead their run game with 19 yards. Remember that Bucs/Saints game last year in Tampa? Yea, that tends to happen when you can't run the ball. Did you blame Brady for that loss?

Read the article as well. It outlines what happened in yesterday's game.

I'm happy you're so open about your lack of integrity or knowledge on this subject. You're fighting against facts as hard as anyone I've seen here in a long time. Keep it up. You newbies have no shame.

He LeD tHeIr RuN gAmE, dAmMiT! lololol

tell us you’ve run out of argument without telling us you’ve run out of argument.

Oh there's plenty of facts left. Unfortunately you have yet to make any argument not based in a lie. Proof of this is the fact that you believe 22 pass attempts means just 22 pass plays were called.

[The Outsider]

The only difference between Jay Cutler and Jameis Winston is skin color. Not that hard really.

Well, that and that Jay Cutler is an immensely better quarterback that Jameis.

[Dread]

His career has been pretty terrible to this point.



Lie



Wrong, they were already down multiple scores. Another lie.



Major lie. You're trying to convince people that there's no fundamental difference in having 4 TD passes, 0 INTs and completing 70% of your passes and having 0 TDs, 1 pick and being around 55% completion (at the time).



again,not true. Winston isn't COMPLETING passes down the field much through 2 weeks. The attempts are there. You'd know this if you truly watched both games.



You were a major supporter of the "yards don't matter" argument a few years back. It's interesting to see you pull a 180 here and all of a sudden use yards as a condemnation.

So it's you who doesn't watch the games.

Jameis was 8/11 for 77yds late in the 2nd quarter just before he ended the 1st half with an INT when the Saints were in FG range.

Here are his passing stats per quarter yesterday

1st: 3/5 for 20yds
2nd: 5/9 for 57 yds (started 5/6 before 3 straight incompletions to end the half)
3rd: 1/2 for 3yds
4th: 2/6 for 31 yds

So in a 2nd half with is team down multiple scores the guy you're deciding to die on hill for goes 3/9 for 34yds. 23 of which came on his second to last throw of the game.

But sure Bootzie, that definitely isn't a conservative passing offense.

[vivalaReagan]

He LeD tHeIr RuN gAmE, dAmMiT! lololol

tell us you’ve run out of argument without telling us you’ve run out of argument.

Oh there's plenty of facts left. Unfortunately you have yet to make any argument not based in a lie. Proof of this is the fact that you believe 22 pass attempts means just 22 pass plays were called.

surrender noted and accepted. well done, bootsie.

[Dread]

I see the Saints media and fans are starting to blame the Saints Oline.

Funny how that works. I'm sure it will be Sean Payton getting blamed soon enough.

[King Bootz]

So it's you who doesn't watch the games.

Jameis was 8/11 for 77yds late in the 2nd quarter just before he ended the 1st half with an INT when the Saints were in FG range.

Here are his passing stats per quarter yesterday

1st: 3/5 for 20yds
2nd: 5/9 for 57 yds (started 5/6 before 3 straight incompletions to end the half)
3rd: 1/2 for 3yds
4th: 2/6 for 31 yds

So in a 2nd half with is team down multiple scores the guy you're deciding to die on hill for goes 3/9 for 34yds. 23 of which came on his second to last throw of the game.

But sure Bootzie, that definitely isn't a conservative passing offense.

Which is it, Dread. 8/10 for 80 late in the 3rd or 8/11 for 77 late in the 2nd? You said both. Only 1 can be true. Which is it?

And again, you clearly didn't watch. Conservative would mean that the play calls were meant to be checkdowns. Why would a QB go through progressions if the initial read was supposed to be a checkdown? If you knew football you'd know that doesn't happen.

Keep digging that hole you've dug yourself in though. The lies are mounting.