All Things Quarterback

[MJW]

Not a tough thread title to diffuse.

Now, personally, I think it's unlikely we draft a QB high. I don't think Arians has any interest in handing the keys to a pup as he nears the end of his career. Heck, he had no interest in Arizona, even when they were screaming for one. He drafted Trask last year as well, so I doubly doubt a quarterback is on his mind.

But Licht, not Arians, is the GM, and Licht will be here in 3 years (probably), while Arians (probably) will not be. If Licht loves a quarterback, I don't think Arians will stand in his way.

Here's how I have them as the process begins. This is all subject to change.

1) Kenny Pickett, PItt. He has all the tools to be a plus NFL quarterback. Maybe a notch below a Superstar, but a guy who can have a Matt Ryan/Matt Stafford kind of career. He needs to work on his pocket presence. He looks to escape too early in the down sometimes. But I don't think the team who drafts him will regret it. I like his mechanics, his physical attributes, and his mental makeup. Unless they make another move, I think the Panthers would be foolish not to take him at #6. He's a 12 year starter.

2) Desmond Ridder, Cincinnati. I wish he'd played better against Alabama, but he's hardly the first good quarterback they've made look bad. He has real upside. He's accurate. He's got a plus arm. He can run. He frequently elevated his supporting cast, and he's noted for his maturity. He's not plug and play I don't think. His mechanics can fall apart at times. He'll need to get eased in, a la Trey Lance. Like Lance he could skyrocket with a strong process. Or he could end up as a 2nd rounder if not.

3) Carson Strong, Nevada. If Ridder is this class's Lance, Strong is this class's Mac Jones. Poised. Accurate. Good mechanics. No threat to run. A better arm than Jones has, but not quite the tape either. Not the highest ceiling, but I think he's safe. This is the guy I could see OBP targeting honestly. He's got Arians-ish arm strength and he does his best work in the pocket. He could be comped to a poor man's Carson Palmer, and he could be there at #27.

4) Matt Corral, Ole Miss. I don't dislike him, but I can't see him here, in this offense. He's a rich man's Gardner Minshew, maybe. Smallish. Adequate, though not great, arm. Good accuracy. Really good movement skills. In a high-percentage spread/RPO type of offense, I'd like him a lot. He's a point guard. But we look for JUGS machines here.

5) Jack Coan, Wisconsin Via Notre Dame. I have him a bit higher than some, but I watched him a lot. He would have looked great in the 80s, throwing bombs for the Bears against the Packers on a snowy Sunday. Big kid, strong arm, good off play action. Not a great athlete. Another guy I could see us targeting, although it'd be in the 2nd (if he shows well) or the 3rd (if he doesn't.)

6) Malik Willis, Liberty. He's a lesser Lamar Jackson, and like Jackson, you'll have to build around him if you're serious. Lots of RPOs. Spread looks. Pistol. Agile linemen. Dual threat tight ends. If you do that, he could be really good. But we're basically the worst possible fit for him, even if he does have the arm. I'd be kind of interested to see Harbaugh develop him in Minnesota the way he did Kaepernick.

7) Sam Howell, North Carolina. I'm not a fan. I just don't see it. I don't see any elite traits, I don't see evidence he can consistently go through his progressions. I don't see great awareness. I don't see elite size or athleticism. I think he'll get overdrafted. I don't think about him before the 3rd, and that's only because I'm willing to acknowledge the possibility I'm wrong.

Please note that my track record with quarterbacks is just plain awful, so take all that with a grain of salt!

[Snake]

Coan will stand tall in the pocket under duress and keep his eyes downfield. I like that about him. Just one little trait that I’ve seen. Obviously there’s a lot more going on that I need to look into.

[Defense5599]

Not sure why the Bucs would be even thinking of drafting a QB early on. Other needs are a lot more pressing. We have a proven starter and a highly touted young guy drafted high already on the roster as the 1 and 2. I say roll with Trask as we will know what he's got in the next two years. If he isn't the guy, start stockpiling draft picks.

[uscbucsfan]

Not sure why the Bucs would be even thinking of drafting a QB early on. Other needs are a lot more pressing. We have a proven starter and a highly touted young guy drafted high already on the roster as the 1 and 2. I say roll with Trask as we will know what he's got in the next two years. If he isn't the guy, start stockpiling draft picks.

Wait, are you talking about Gabbert?

[Snake]

Well, he’s proven he’s terrible when starting.

13-35 record. 56% completions. 50/47 TDs and INTs.

[Jonny]

Not sure why the Bucs would be even thinking of drafting a QB early on. Other needs are a lot more pressing. We have a proven starter and a highly touted young guy drafted high already on the roster as the 1 and 2. I say roll with Trask as we will know what he's got in the next two years. If he isn't the guy, start stockpiling draft picks.

Gabbert has proven what exactly as a starter?

[Defense5599]

Not sure why the Bucs would be even thinking of drafting a QB early on. Other needs are a lot more pressing. We have a proven starter and a highly touted young guy drafted high already on the roster as the 1 and 2. I say roll with Trask as we will know what he's got in the next two years. If he isn't the guy, start stockpiling draft picks.

Gabbert has proven what exactly as a starter?

In his three years as a starter, he went through three different head coaches and three different OC's. He put up some decent numbers his first two years. At this point, you roll with him hoping he can manage the game until Trask is ready to take over. At some point, you'll have to throw Trask into the river and see if he can sink or swim.

[uscbucsfan]

Gabbert has proven what exactly as a starter?

In his three years as a starter, he went through three different head coaches and three different OC's. He put up some decent numbers his first two years. At this point, you roll with him hoping he can manage the game until Trask is ready to take over. At some point, you'll have to throw Trask into the river and see if he can sink or swim.

Good thing you aren't running the Bucs. Gabbert is terrible and unless we are paying our coach $100k additional per game, he's not going start. Licht all but said we are looking for other options.

[Jonny]

Gabbert has proven what exactly as a starter?

In his three years as a starter, he went through three different head coaches and three different OC's. He put up some decent numbers his first two years. At this point, you roll with him hoping he can manage the game until Trask is ready to take over. At some point, you'll have to throw Trask into the river and see if he can sink or swim.

Posts like this bring back memories of being a Bucs fan before the Brady era. Our standards were extremely low and some of us were making excuses for trash QB play of Winston, Freeman etc. Heck I was at one point excited about Lovie Smith hiring and their move to go with Josh McClown as the starting QB. You remind me of me. We are truly back to sucking again.

[Primeminister]

I haven’t visited the draft forum since Brady. I’ll be following you draftniks to see which QB I’ll be banging the table for.

Thanks for dusting off the draft forum.

[Cheb]

Frankly, if it were up to me I wouldn't draft a quarterback this year.

We have our promising young player. Trask was good in college and hasn't shown anything to make us think he regressed. Moreover, he just spent a year sharing a meeting room with Tom Brady, which no new rookie would be able to say.

I'd rather roll with Trask and upgrade the team around him than roll the dice on a new rookie quarterback.

[Primeminister]

Frankly, if it were up to me I wouldn't draft a quarterback this year.

We have our promising young player. Trask was good in college and hasn't shown anything to make us think he regressed. Moreover, he just spent a year sharing a meeting room with Tom Brady, which no new rookie would be able to say.

I'd rather roll with Trask and upgrade the team around him than roll the dice on a new rookie quarterback.

Part of me agrees with this. However another part of me just watched two years of Tom Brady running this offense and doesn’t want to go back to the QB hopefuls.

[MJW]

Frankly, if it were up to me I wouldn't draft a quarterback this year.

We have our promising young player. Trask was good in college and hasn't shown anything to make us think he regressed. Moreover, he just spent a year sharing a meeting room with Tom Brady, which no new rookie would be able to say.

I'd rather roll with Trask and upgrade the team around him than roll the dice on a new rookie quarterback.

Part of me agrees with this. However another part of me just watched two years of Tom Brady running this offense and doesn’t want to go back to the QB hopefuls.

Agree with this. I will have no problem with the Bucs not drafting a QB. At the same time, it is entirely possible that OBP will see someone they love who they think has a higher ceiling than Trask. They'd be foolish not to pull the trigger because Trask is already here. I kinda hinted at it above, but I think that guy would be Carson Strong. He just looks and plays like an Arians QB. Pure pocket guy, great size, and unlike Trask he has a cannon.

[BLT]

In his three years as a starter, he went through three different head coaches and three different OC's. He put up some decent numbers his first two years. At this point, you roll with him hoping he can manage the game until Trask is ready to take over. At some point, you'll have to throw Trask into the river and see if he can sink or swim.

Posts like this bring back memories of being a Bucs fan before the Brady era. Our standards were extremely low and some of us were making excuses for trash QB play of Winston, Freeman etc. Heck I was at one point excited about Lovie Smith hiring and their move to go with Josh McClown as the starting QB. You remind me of me. We are truly back to sucking again.

People actually used to make Pro arguments for Bruce Gradkowski and Mike Glennon.

Hopefully Brady has changed that forever.

Thanks, Tom.

[kaimaru]

Part of me agrees with this. However another part of me just watched two years of Tom Brady running this offense and doesn’t want to go back to the QB hopefuls.

Agree with this. I will have no problem with the Bucs not drafting a QB. At the same time, it is entirely possible that OBP will see someone they love who they think has a higher ceiling than Trask. They'd be foolish not to pull the trigger because Trask is already here. I kinda hinted at it above, but I think that guy would be Carson Strong. He just looks and plays like an Arians QB. Pure pocket guy, great size, and unlike Trask he has a cannon.

I'm not sure, per this article, Arians doesn't want a rookie or second year QB.

With Tom Brady retiring as expected, Bruce Arians is left with a playoff-caliber roster that lacks a starting QB,” wrote Benjamin. “Emphasizing ‘reloading’ rather than rebuilding, he’d surely prefer a proven veteran as a short-term fix. Besides the irony of succeeding his old Patriots counterpart in Tampa, Garoppolo would at least be an upgrade over the middling free agent QBs.

https://heavy.com/sports/tampa-bay-bucc ... garoppolo/

[MJW]

Agree with this. I will have no problem with the Bucs not drafting a QB. At the same time, it is entirely possible that OBP will see someone they love who they think has a higher ceiling than Trask. They'd be foolish not to pull the trigger because Trask is already here. I kinda hinted at it above, but I think that guy would be Carson Strong. He just looks and plays like an Arians QB. Pure pocket guy, great size, and unlike Trask he has a cannon.

I'm not sure, per this article, Arians doesn't want a rookie or second year QB.

With Tom Brady retiring as expected, Bruce Arians is left with a playoff-caliber roster that lacks a starting QB,” wrote Benjamin. “Emphasizing ‘reloading’ rather than rebuilding, he’d surely prefer a proven veteran as a short-term fix. Besides the irony of succeeding his old Patriots counterpart in Tampa, Garoppolo would at least be an upgrade over the middling free agent QBs.

https://heavy.com/sports/tampa-bay-bucc ... garoppolo/

I think it's pretty clear Arians does not want to play a young QB. He's drafted two quarterbacks in the 8 drafts he's been involved with - Logan Thomas, who he moved to tight end, and Trask.

Here's a complete list of quarterbacks who've gotten snaps on his teams, starting with Arizona:

2013 - Carson Palmer (Age: 34)
2014 - Carson Palmer (35), Drew Stanton (30), Ryan Lindley (25, and he was the emergency 3rd stringer.)
2015 - Carson Palmer (36), Drew Stanton (31)
2016 - Carson Palmer (37), Drew Stanton (32)
2017 - Carson Palmer (38), Drew Stanton (33), Blaine Gabbert (28)
2019 - Jameis Winston (25, but inherited), Ryan Griffin (30)
2020 - Tom Brady (43), Blaine Gabbert (31)
2021 - Tom Brady (44), Blaine Gabbert (32)

This is not a guy who even wants a young QB on his roster, much less getting meaningful snaps, much much less starting.

BUT, this is still a conversation that should be had IMHO. Because he's not the only one making these decisions.

[Defense5599]

I'm not sure, per this article, Arians doesn't want a rookie or second year QB.



https://heavy.com/sports/tampa-bay-bucc ... garoppolo/

I think it's pretty clear Arians does not want to play a young QB. He's drafted two quarterbacks in the 8 drafts he's been involved with - Logan Thomas, who he moved to tight end, and Trask.

Here's a complete list of quarterbacks who've gotten snaps on his teams, starting with Arizona:

2013 - Carson Palmer (Age: 34)
2014 - Carson Palmer (35), Drew Stanton (30), Ryan Lindley (25, and he was the emergency 3rd stringer.)
2015 - Carson Palmer (36), Drew Stanton (31)
2016 - Carson Palmer (37), Drew Stanton (32)
2017 - Carson Palmer (38), Drew Stanton (33), Blaine Gabbert (28)
2019 - Jameis Winston (25, but inherited), Ryan Griffin (30)
2020 - Tom Brady (43), Blaine Gabbert (31)
2021 - Tom Brady (44), Blaine Gabbert (32)

This is not a guy who even wants a young QB on his roster, much less getting meaningful snaps, much much less starting.

BUT, this is still a conversation that should be had IMHO. Because he's not the only one making these decisions.

I wonder what kind of conversation it will be. After all, I'm sure he had a hand in Licht drafting Trask. He's known around the league as a "QB Whisperer" but outside of Jameis, he's worked only with proven QBs like Peyton Manning and Andrew Luck in addition to the guys you have listed above.

[acmillis]

I wouldn't call Peyton Manning or Andrew Luck any more "proven" than Winston (or Trask, Or Lawrence, or any other rookie QB for that matter) was. BA and Peyton, and later Luck entered INDY the same year.

I could see a conversation between BA and Licht where Licht says something like, "Coach, I really want to see what we have in Trask or draft a QB semi-high in the draft.

BA responds with something like, "Jason, I completely understand and I think Byron would be the perfect coach to build that rookie in to a NFL QB." BNA rides (drunkenly) off in to the sunset.

[Grahamburn]

Frankly, if it were up to me I wouldn't draft a quarterback this year.

We have our promising young player. Trask was good in college and hasn't shown anything to make us think he regressed. Moreover, he just spent a year sharing a meeting room with Tom Brady, which no new rookie would be able to say.

I'd rather roll with Trask and upgrade the team around him than roll the dice on a new rookie quarterback.

Even though I Agree with you it’s tough to look some of these veteran players in the eye if Trask can’t get it done.

They just spent two years with Tom Brady. Bad spot for Trask and the organization.

[Jonny]

Based on Pewter report, who I trust when it comes to assessment of draft prospects for Bucs, looks like there is nothing to be excited about on the QB front except for maybe Malik Willis who would not be a fit for BA. I think Willis is a more accurate passer, more natural passer and an anticipatory thrower than Jalen Hurts. I think his floor is Jalen Hurts, but ceiling is complete unknown since a team starting him would have to make a commitment to him like Ravens did with Jackson.

[13F11B]

Based on what I am reading in the raft profiles, I am guessing Trask would have been rated above all these guys with the exception of Pickett.

[Kress]

I like the conversation just because, but I don't see any scenario where QB is even a consideration for the Bucs. I cannot find anyone in this draft to get excited about to begin with, and then you have to factor in the reality that other teams will inevitably snatch up whatever top prospects do exist. So... we draft the best of the rest in the late 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round? For what? He'll be a worse prospect than Trask, and without a year of Brady worship under his belt. We'd have those two guys on our roster with a team that is otherwise capable of winning a crappy NFC South. I just can't force my head to make it work.

[Cheb]

I like the conversation just because, but I don't see any scenario where QB is even a consideration for the Bucs. I cannot find anyone in this draft to get excited about to begin with, and then you have to factor in the reality that other teams will inevitably snatch up whatever top prospects do exist. So... we draft the best of the rest in the late 2nd, 3rd, or 4th round? For what? He'll be a worse prospect than Trask, and without a year of Brady worship under his belt. We'd have those two guys on our roster with a team that is otherwise capable of winning a crappy NFC South. I just can't force my head to make it work.

Seconded on all counts.

Another point. Which would you rather have, whatever rookie quarterback is left in the late first on draft night, or Trask PLUS a talented first round rookie at a position that'll see alot of snaps like defensive tackle or receiver.

Option B, imo, is infinitely preferable.

[Snake]

It would take an Aaron Rodgers falling type situation for the Bucs to take a QB in the first. And I dunno who that player could be.

[Kress]

I don't think there is one. And I will always remain on the "best player available" bandwagon for your 1st round pick. I don't care about the position or how stacked we are at whatever position that might be, you take talent. If you have too much of it, that is future trade capital at the very least. Round one, draft talent.

[acmillis]

I don't think there is one. And I will always remain on the "best player available" bandwagon for your 1st round pick. I don't care about the position or how stacked we are at whatever position that might be, you take talent. If you have too much of it, that is future trade capital at the very least. Round one, draft talent.

I'm generally with you, but OJ Howard was clearly BPA and that didn't work out. I also wouldn't draft a RB in the first, even if they were BPA.

[Kress]

I don't think there is one. And I will always remain on the "best player available" bandwagon for your 1st round pick. I don't care about the position or how stacked we are at whatever position that might be, you take talent. If you have too much of it, that is future trade capital at the very least. Round one, draft talent.

I'm generally with you, but OJ Howard was clearly BPA and that didn't work out. I also wouldn't draft a RB in the first, even if they were BPA.

Yeah, and Tom Brady was... well, you know. You can't formulate a rule around singular examples.

[The Outsider]

Hypothetical, do we think Gabbert can maybe do the job this season? He's always had the physical tools, he was just not nearly ready for the NFL and got thrown in to the fire by a garbage franchise. He's stuck around this long as a back-up so you would assume he's improved the mental part of his game at least somewhat and he's only 32.

[Jonny]

Hypothetical, do we think Gabbert can maybe do the job this season? He's always had the physical tools, he was just not nearly ready for the NFL and got thrown in to the fire by a garbage franchise. He's stuck around this long as a back-up so you would assume he's improved the mental part of his game at least somewhat and he's only 32.

Every time Gabbert subbed in for Brady and attempted a pass, he's looked horrible and lost. The biggest sample size we have of him is from the Lions game last season (2020) and if that is any sort of a preview, I would gladly roll with Jameis who may come cheaper than Gabbert. I may be mistaken, but he also probably started a few drives during the preseason with first team offense and looked horrendous.

[Snake]

Hypothetical, do we think Gabbert can maybe do the job this season? He's always had the physical tools, he was just not nearly ready for the NFL and got thrown in to the fire by a garbage franchise. He's stuck around this long as a back-up so you would assume he's improved the mental part of his game at least somewhat and he's only 32.

If “the job” means tank job, yes I think he is. Though, the roster is good enough to win some games in spite of him.

[kaimaru]

Hypothetical, do we think Gabbert can maybe do the job this season? He's always had the physical tools, he was just not nearly ready for the NFL and got thrown in to the fire by a garbage franchise. He's stuck around this long as a back-up so you would assume he's improved the mental part of his game at least somewhat and he's only 32.

If “the job” means tank job, yes I think he is. Though, the roster is good enough to win some games in spite of him.

Well, if Arians got even a whiff that they were going to tank, then he would be gone in a second. So there is no way we are taking. Trask barely got reps and they were working on his footwork, throwing motions, and the playbook for the most part this season. I doubt they have any confidence of rolling with Trask. I wouldn't want Gabbert, he looked like crap. Then again he was mostly playing with backups.

I wouldn't go with anyone in this draft.